IVY LEAGUE THROWING RENAISSANCE

Great summary, and thanks! Two very minor points:

It's Halley's Comet.

Word is that Winkler injured a knee, the week leading to indoor Heps. I haven't heard definitively, but it looks like he might not be throwing for a good while.

"move objects a far ways"

Ouch.

Colloquialisms aside, I hope you are a big enough fan of the throws to come watch these kids throw this season. The grammar is a far ways from perfect but the kids do at least one use of the slang justice. Cheers.

That's a shame about Winkler. I was wondering why he did not compete in the weight at Heps. Freshman year injuries are so common with throwers. Lots of over use, new positions and new load amounts to handle in the weight room. I hope he recovers soon. Thanks for the info.

I appreciate the Ivy thrower shout out. They do deserve their recognition. I am not a thrower, but I have grown to appreciate these aspect in track and field in recent years.

I agree that Mattis, Ratcliffe, Okwelogu, and Mozia can grow. Mattis just missed out on qualifying out of NCAA regionals last year (he was 13th, and only top 12 go). Okwelogu needs to get at least another 3 feet on her shot put before I'd be comfortable in thinking she's a NCAA lock as a freshman (isn't she a stronger discus thrower?) I know Ratcliffe is training for the Commonwealth Games this summer, so she's training for June/July peak anyways. And if Mozia can keep his confidence up, he'll be nearly unstoppable come outdoors. It's hard to believe that he's only won his first indoor conference shot put title as a junior, when the last 2 years, he came into Heps with the top marks.

I am not too familiar with javelin throwers in general, but they always seem to me to be a bit finicky or unpredictable in terms of performance. A few years ago, Craig Kinsley won NCAAs in the javelin as a junior, but I don't even think he qualified for NCAAs as a senior and defending champion the next year.

I hope Adabelle can break 200-ft in the hammer this year, but she will still have to play 2nd fiddle to Ratcliffe. Hey, Adabelle bested Ratcliffe 3 out of 4 times they met in indoors for the weight throw, so outdoors is Ratcliffe's time to shine.

Regardless, these athletes you've highlighted (and others you have not, like Harvard's Josh Whitener) are redefining the Ivy throwing scene. I hope it can show high schoolers that Ivies can produce more than talented distance runners.

The recruiting is always the toughest part. For a top 10 HS throws recruit it is tough to turn down a scholarship to Stanford, Duke, Notre Dame and other top schools to join the ancient 8. This is especially true when those programs present you with world class facilities, coaches and other amenities.

However, the quality of the coaching has gotten better for the Ivy League throwers over the past few years. Just look at what coach Megan Johnson from Cornell has accomplished with Mozia, Singh, and Rhodes and her other throwers like Imbesi in 2013. Coach Samara has always done a great job as well. Coach DArcy Wilson at Brown has done a fine job as has Harvard's Dubs and Tenisci at Penn. Except for a hand full of throwers I think there were PRs all over the league indoors.

Terence Mann (James Earl Jones) said in the Field of Dreams "build it and they will come." The Ivy league is paying attention to the value of the throws and how to make good throwers better and great throwers exceptional. It starts with more educated coaches (we seem to have that), a commitment to better facilities and sensible training, access to competitive schedules and then selling the package to high schoolers who are academically strong and up to the challenge.

The days of the Ivy track teams operating like extracurricular clubs where all comers are taken are hopefully behind us. Each team over the last few years has seen individuals who are truly exceptional athletes. That rubs off on a program and elevates everyone attached. The boats have now been lifted and now we get to see what other conferences in the nation take for granted. It is once again a joy to be an Ivy League track fan.

JUSTHEPSTHROWS2014 wrote:

Terence Mann (James Earl Jones) said in the Field of Dreams "build it and they will come." The Ivy league is paying attention to the value of the throws and how to make good throwers better and great throwers exceptional. It starts with more educated coaches (we seem to have that), a commitment to better facilities and sensible training, access to competitive schedules and then selling the package to high schoolers who are academically strong and up to the challenge.

I feel programs are doing a much better job of developing more well-rounded, competitive programs. Just take a look at the top-10 all time listings on Hepstrack.com and you can see that there have been so many changes to the recordbooks in the last 5 to 10 years across all of the events. Indoors alone, there were 4 women sprinters below 7.50 for the 60m, which is fast for this conference. The mile's top-10 had a number of rewrites these last few years. Perhaps the horizontal jumps have not been as rewritten as much as the other throws, but those are still some strong performances.

And yes, getting in is the hardest part, and it's nearly has hard to stay in. Conor McCullough somehow got into Princeton but essentially flunked out, even after taking that year off to refocus. I hope the other athletes will be able to keep their grades up as well as their performances.

I absolutely agree with your analysis of the records books as a litmus test for the improvement and balancing out of performances across all the events.

What we ares seeing as well is kids coming in with much better coaching at the high school level than before.

Mozia was a mid sixties thrower in HS, 180s with discus. Mattis was 218 in discus and #5 on US high school all time list. Winkler you already know about. Radcliffe had top coaching in New Zealand. So they come prepared and I'm sure they leave nothing to chance as not all college coaches are created equally.

But I'm sure the education was primary concern for them all and then they likely fill any coaching gaps with summer work with top clinicians. . . just like any top athlete would.

As it relates to McCullough, I was told that he actually flunked out twice. Not that he wasn't bright, he apparently lacked motivation and was skipping classes and also chose a major in the sciences that just won't tolerate lack of focus.

I know from the boards and NCAA announcements Hay and Mattis were carrying 3.5s or better and were named USTFCCCA All-Academic. I'm sure the others are no slouches as well. Connor was in trouble his freshman year and just could not cut it at Princeton. It was a shame. Hopefully, he's thriving where ever he is.

Julia Ratcliffe pops a massive 68.71 meter (225-0) at Sam Howell in Princeton to take the top NCAA spot by 8 feet in the women's hammer throw. This is also the 14th best throw worldwide as of today, April 5th.

Sam Mattis breaks 60 meter mark for #2 all time Heps in discus at Sam Howell. He threw 60.50 (198'7"). NCAA #6 and 24th on the world's list as of today. Terrible cold and wind conditions for all the long the throwers. Heavy tail and swirling winds pushing all throws down and sideways. Should be interesting to see what good low wind conditions will produce.

Both throws are meet an school records as well as Ivy League leading efforts in this still very young season.

Mozia also won Hammer, discus and shot put events at Stanford invite! Impressive showing for the Cornell titan.

Holy cow, what throwers we are blessed with in the league this year!!!

Read more:

http://www.letsrun.com/forum/flat_read.php?thread=5479455&page=8#ixzz2y4nEseHk

Some good results at Larry Ellis:

1. Mattis over 60 meters twice. 60.04 and 61.87 (203")! Followed by fellow Quaker Noah Kennedy White at 170'10.

2. 4 kids over 55 feet in Shot put:

Cook, Chris Princeton 56-10.25

Liokumovich, Igor Harvard 55-11.25

Rushton, Scott Princeton 55-09.75

Brenza, Jacob Penn 55-03.50

3. Kelsey Hay of Penn over 150 again: 46.34m 152-00

4. Ratcliffe of Princeton launches a huge PR: 70.28m 230-07

5. Sullivan of Harvard tosses Sullivan, 64.00m 210-00

Nice progressions before Penn Relays and Heps.

Well, some strangeness at Mt. SAC:

Cornell's Stephen Mozia was scheduled to compete there, skipping the Princeton meet. But word was that he was going to represent Nigeria in the meet, not Cornell (although the NCAA/Ivy League would still credit his results).

But the best I could find for him(?) in the shot is this:

brian sax Cornell University 19.62m 64-04.50

I have *no* idea who Brian Sax might be--no such name appears on Cornell's roster--but have to think that someone screwed up,and that this was actually Mozia. Crazy to think that on an (apparent) "off" day, Mozia is still over 64 feet.

They did have him down correctly in the discus:

Stephen Mozia Nigeria 59.56m 195-05

lease wrote:

Well, some strangeness at Mt. SAC:

_________________________________________________________

Cornell's Stephen Mozia was scheduled to compete there, skipping the Princeton meet. But word was that he was going to represent Nigeria in the meet, not Cornell (although the NCAA/Ivy League would still credit his results).

But the best I could find for him(?) in the shot is this:

brian sax Cornell University 19.62m 64-04.50

I have *no* idea who Brian Sax might be--no such name appears on Cornell's roster--but have to think that someone screwed up,and that this was actually Mozia. Crazy to think that on an (apparent) "off" day, Mozia is still over 64 feet.

They did have him down correctly in the discus:

Stephen Mozia Nigeria 59.56m 195-05

___________________________________________________________

Yes, I saw that as well in the results. I guess the Brian Sax entry was a misprint as I can't find a Brian Sax on the CU roster. I guess for international meets he'll now be permanently representing Nigeria? His outdoor results are consistently around 63-64 it seems. The transition to the outdoor shot takes a little longer for some putters. I think by Penn Relays or Heps he'll be right back at the 66-68 level. Only Crouser looks to be consistent in the 69 foot range. However, technically he's quite sound. There are very few deviations in his form this year compared to last. NCAAs will still be a 2 man fling off i believe. Mozia is a bit streaky but that streak can come at the right time. Let's hope it does in Eugene.

Brian Sax is a former Princeton runner who competed in the Masters 800 (and ran 2:01). Sounds like they just got the competitor number mixed up.

It happens. Last week at Texas Invitational they screwed every throw and athlete in the 2nd flight until a few hours after the meet was completed.

Augie Wolf was twice suspended from competition, once in 1985 for refusing a drug test and second circa 1989 for a testosterone positive as I recall.

I remember the 1985 suspension for refusing to take the test. There are articles on this. The 1989 testosterone suspension I don't recall. Is there an article on this?

Horace Dycke wrote:

Augie Wolf was twice suspended from competition, once in 1985 for refusing a drug test and second circa 1989 for a testosterone positive as I recall.

Here's a link to the Wikipedia entry for Augie Wolf:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augie_Wolf

And here's a relevant excerpt:

"During his athletic career, Wolf was suspended from competition on two occasions. The International Association of Athletics Federations (IAAF) initially banned Wolf for life after ruling he had refused post-match testing on July 7, 1985 in Byrkjelo, Norway.[5] Supported by the USA Track & Field Federation, he appealed citing errors in the testing notification. The ban was reduced to an eighteen month suspension and he returned to competition in 1987.[6][7] After the 1989 Indoor Nationals he was again suspended after testing positive for elevated testosterone levels, but The Athletics Congress overturned that suspension on appeal.[8]"

So the first suspension was reduced and the second was overturned.

Thanks for the supporting info. A lot of athletes tried to justify using PEDs during that period using the argument that it was the only way to be competitive since the Europeans were doing it and winning. It seems to me that the period of the early 1970s and early 1990s was so dirty that all world records during that period should be asterisked. Auggie Wolf is just another example of a guy who took the easy way to short-lived fame using the weak argument that if I didn't drug I could not compete well. Calvin Smith is the counter argument to this silly proposition. Run hard, run well and let history sort out the cheats from the true heroes.

A lot of people don't seem to understand that PEDs like steroids are not used to *avoid* hard work; they're taken to allow *harder* work.

There are a few exception--the dilettantes, I call them--but as a rule the juicers are the hardest-working, most dedicated guys in the gym.