Yes, ban xenon!
Why, you seem to be a nice enough person?
wouldn't EPO be cheaper per dose?
I found the quoted part of the statement below--in bold text--by Richard Pound, former WADA leader, to be interesting.
"Until recently, doping investigators were not aware of the use of the noble gas xenon as a performance-enhancing agent in sport and, what's more, it could not be identified by previous testing methods, as it is a gas and so does not leave any traces that can be measured in routine control procedures, doping expert Mario Thevis of the WADA-accredited control laboratory in Cologne has confirmed to WDR. Xenon has not previously been listed by name on the Prohibited List. Former WADA president Richard Pound (Canada) describes the inhalation of xenon as a clear case of doping: "Something like this has been developed solely to enhance performance - as far as I'm concerned, that's doping."
"Something" and "soely to enhance performance" are a key word and phrase. This is too wide open of a claim. "Something" could be almost anything.
is it cost effective? wrote:
wouldn't EPO be cheaper per dose?
I think the idea is they can convince themselves they're not doping even though WADA's rules are pretty clear on substances not yet banned.
But, Xenon gas does not add EPO to your system. The natural EPO is already in your body.
This is a very fuzzy area. If you only enhance what already exists in your body then you should not be considered to be doping. But, if Xenon gas is something than can cause health problems then it should be banned.
Anyone know if NOP has been using xenon? Does Rupp keep canisters in his house?
exactly. why wouldn't altitude tents then also be banned?
around 1:55. xenon heavier than air, prolly should have stood on his head to get it to flow back out of his lungs
Big deal. Ban altitude tents.
All the fancy drug tricks for blood boosting would be banned without hesitation if the line was drawn at any kind of artificial method, such as altitude tents.
legal: live, train at altitude, breathe xenon at hot spring that emits it naturally.
illegal: sleep in altitude tent, breathe xenon from bottle.
Exceptions only for basic nutrition supplements like vitamins and minerals.
As long as altitude tents are legal, anti-doping will be stranded in a morass of ethical ambiguity.
Altitude tents are something developed solely to enhance performance.
There goes Paula Radcliffe.. etc.
The difference is xenon is an chemical that is inhaled to boost EPO production. Altitude tents simply alter the density of oxygen in the air. With altitude tents there is no physiological change brought on by another chemical. So that's why altitude tents have been ruled legal for the past 12 or 13 years.
"High altitude products have shown increases in RBC and EPO concentrations in the body"
See page 8 of this PowerPoint from the U of Massachusetts.
http://courses.umass.edu/kin380/Lecture%2019%20Altitude%20Training%20and%20EPO.ppt
Also, read up on what the Russians said they were doing. They were using Xenon gas in altitude tents.
Xenon-free runner wrote:
"High altitude products have shown increases in RBC and EPO concentrations in the body"
See page 8 of this PowerPoint from the U of Massachusetts.
http://courses.umass.edu/kin380/Lecture%2019%20Altitude%20Training%20and%20EPO.pptAlso, read up on what the Russians said they were doing. They were using Xenon gas in altitude tents.
Yes, altitude tents have the effect of increasing RBC and EPO, but once again the athlete is not inahaling, ingesting, or injecting any chemicals. It's maniupulation of oxygen density to simulate high altitude. There is a difference. Moreover, WADA (whether the wanted to or not, because didn't it come to the courts eventually?) has allowed altitude tents since the early 2000s. Altitude tents Are Not Banned. Chemicals Are Banned.
And yes, I have been reading on the Russians.
Message Boarder wrote:
The difference is xenon is an chemical that is inhaled to boost EPO production. Altitude tents simply alter the density of oxygen in the air. With altitude tents there is no physiological change brought on by another chemical. So that's why altitude tents have been ruled legal for the past 12 or 13 years.
Altitude tents don't lower the air pressure while keeping oxygen at 20.9%. Instead, they increase the nitrogen percentage and reduce the oxygen percentage in the tent. Since xenon is inert and not reacting with anything in the body, how is manipulating what is breathed with xenon any different than manipulating the also inert nitrogen percentage? Seems like using xenon is basically like using an altitude tent (or is using an altitude tent).
Xenon gas and altitude tents seems to produce the same effect, stimulation of natural EPO production. Maybe the question for WADA is, "why haven't you established a limit for natural EPO production." WADA should be legally forced to set a standard, and notify everyone, before they are legally allowed to ban anyone. This seems to be the direction this should be going.
Message Boarder wrote:
Xenon-free runner wrote:"High altitude products have shown increases in RBC and EPO concentrations in the body"
See page 8 of this PowerPoint from the U of Massachusetts.
http://courses.umass.edu/kin380/Lecture%2019%20Altitude%20Training%20and%20EPO.pptAlso, read up on what the Russians said they were doing. They were using Xenon gas in altitude tents.
Yes, altitude tents have the effect of increasing RBC and EPO, but once again the athlete is not inahaling, ingesting, or injecting any chemicals. It's maniupulation of oxygen density to simulate high altitude. There is a difference. Moreover, WADA (whether the wanted to or not, because didn't it come to the courts eventually?) has allowed altitude tents since the early 2000s. Altitude tents Are Not Banned. Chemicals Are Banned.
And yes, I have been reading on the Russians.
Okay but then do you have an argument against blood doping? No new chemicals there, just removing and adding your own blood.
Would the use of xenon (to enhance natural EPO) show up as an anomaly in "biological passport" testing?
Okay Fanboyz wrote:
Okay but then do you have an argument against blood doping? No new chemicals there, just removing and adding your own blood.
Is this a serious post? Blood doping is very dangerous.