• ROC
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/16/2007 10:41PM - in reply to jkicks
      • ROC
      • The latest:

        Had bi-lat hernia surgery in early Jan. I was definitely diagnosed correctly, had some slight bulges on both sides which had to be addressed. Surgeon said upfront this might not cure what was ailing me, but I was hoping that was the source of the pain. So, 2 months later, little to no running, couldn't tell if the problem was solved, hoped for the best, ran a 1/2 marathon in Sacramento to get a qualifying time for NYC marathon in the fall, which I did barely, but the pain is still there, just like previous to the surgery. My question, and I believe I've read it somewhere before in the X amount of pages in this thread, could I have had, in addition, a sports hernia? Or any other ideas, i'm kinda at wits end, and am pretty close to coming to grips with the fact i'm aging, and might not be able to do long races, and will have to stick w/ shorter ones. All i can say is that in the general groin area, they flare and tighten as I run anything over 6 miles.

        Any help, advice appreciated...

        ROC
    • johnny
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/19/2007 8:25AM - in reply to jkicks
      • johnny
      • i met up with dr m last week to be checked out.
        she says that my lingering pain is due to the fact that i had a sh full-blown for so long without treatment. she says the brain remembers the injury thus it is still feeling pain signals despite the fact that i am all sewn up and the groin is intact just fine.
        she said that she would not do the injections since it would possibly make the pain worse. i am not sure if that meant that she doesn't recommend shots into the nerves but does recommend the injections into the adductors and other muscles that are painful.
        she says that the longer one has the injury, the longer it takes to go away. apparently some have had it for years, and it takes that long to go away post-op.
        keep in mind that when most of the pros get surgery, they get it within decent time since they have good trainers (etc) and are always monitored, thus often receive the right diagnosis and treatment sequence.

        i do know, though, that the nerves involved in the injury are embedded in the fascia of the muscles in the abdomen (psoas, iliacus, obliques, transverse, and pectineus). the fascia tightens as a result of injury, and the nerve gets irritated. i think, when the fascia is loosened, the nerve will start to heal. but then again, this is all trial and error at the moment. i am awaiting her email so i can better understand the deal with the shots. when i met with her, she was also teaching some american docs about what she does, so both of us were distracted and i didn't get the whole grasp of why and why not for the injections.
        i'll post when i hear.

        johnny
    • RunDaddy
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/19/2007 11:51AM - in reply to johnny
      • RunDaddy
      • johnny wrote:
        i met up with dr m last week to be checked out.
        she says that my lingering pain is due to the fact that i had a sh full-blown for so long without treatment. she says the brain remembers the injury thus it is still feeling pain signals despite the fact that i am all sewn up and the groin is intact just fine.
        she said that she would not do the injections since it would possibly make the pain worse. i am not sure if that meant that she doesn't recommend shots into the nerves but does recommend the injections into the adductors and other muscles that are painful.
        she says that the longer one has the injury, the longer it takes to go away. apparently some have had it for years, and it takes that long to go away post-op.
        keep in mind that when most of the pros get surgery, they get it within decent time since they have good trainers (etc) and are always monitored, thus often receive the right diagnosis and treatment sequence.

        i do know, though, that the nerves involved in the injury are embedded in the fascia of the muscles in the abdomen (psoas, iliacus, obliques, transverse, and pectineus). the fascia tightens as a result of injury, and the nerve gets irritated. i think, when the fascia is loosened, the nerve will start to heal. but then again, this is all trial and error at the moment. i am awaiting her email so i can better understand the deal with the shots. when i met with her, she was also teaching some american docs about what she does, so both of us were distracted and i didn't get the whole grasp of why and why not for the injections.
        i'll post when i hear.

        johnny
        Has anyone else gone from unilateral to bi-lateral? Or, once one side was done (in my case the left), gotten it on the other side? If so, how long between injuries.

        I'm 5 weeks out and running again. I'm up to about 35 minutes easy. I'm starting to get some pain (more like stiffness) on the right side after about 20 minutes of running. It's different than what happened on the left, but it's freaking me out nonetheless.

        There must be some strengthening exercises that can mitigate against getting it on the opposite side of the original injury.
    • jamer
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/20/2007 9:40AM - in reply to osaru
      • jamer
      • Curious how your treatment went in Germany? I had s.h. surgury a year ago with Dr. Stiegmann in Denver..did pretty well until the past two weeks and it seems to have returned. Interested in the munich route now. You can respond to me at my website: www.highmesafitness.com

        thanks
    • buckman
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/20/2007 11:00AM - in reply to Sale Harrier's Runner
      • buckman
      • Sale Harrier's Runner-

        I've posted in this thread a couple times before- and I would say your issues are caused by improper biomechanics, imbalances, and supporting your weight with the wrong muscles. Basically you want to carry your weight through your hips and glutes- but if you support it through your adductors and front of pelvis you will eventually run into major problems. Check some of my previous posts in this thread.

        I'd recommend you take a long time off of running (a year?) and get your biomechanics working properly. Take a year now to get healthy so you can run the rest of your life.
    • jmo
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/20/2007 12:38PM - in reply to buckman
      • jmo
      • I've spent the last two days reading most of the threads here. I am a non-athletic mother of two who was trying to run off the baby fat... I was diagnosed bursitis, tendonitis and went to PT to help that, but had to quit because of a painful groin area. After a few months of rest I have still have groin pain up to my left hip. My doctor said it could be a sports hernia... My pain is not severe, but it is keeping me from normal activities, I haven't worked out since October and I can feel the ache constantly... Whom should I see in Chicago?

        Frustrated...
    • jeff55
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/20/2007 11:49PM - in reply to RunDaddy
      • jeff55
      • Run Daddy, It was probably in an earlier post, but who did yours?

        After reading much of this thread, and hearing all the problems, I'm hoping that those who healed easily, whether with or without surgery, have happily gone on their way and are no longer heard from. Otherwise, the outlook is pretty bleak. I probably have an sh. I'm 55 years old, and a recreational soccer player and runner, but also a builder, so I still need my body for work. I think I had a mild sh 4 years ago that healed when I laid off of soccer for three months and did some pt. At that time I could run without pain, I just always felt like I had to urinate when I ran. Anybody had that symptom? This time it came on after I got too cranked up in a soccer game and did my first bicycle kick in many years. I felt just a little wierdness afterwards, but within a few days I was in real pain when I played. Gradually cut down my activity all fall, but never could get over it, so I tried 6 weeks of no running, biking (which usually doesn't hurt) or soccer. Mostly pain free, but I did get some pain even if I just walked three miles or more. My question is if anybody has any input on my specific symptoms:
        1. No tenderness or pain on external pressure anywhere.
        2. Pain usually isn't during exercise, but the next day it comes on, then gets worse the second day.
        3. After I abuse it and get pain, it is always 5 days until the pain goes away-always the same.
        4. Can bike moderate distance, but tried just a 1 1/2 mile run, and the pain was there the next day.
        5. Pain was originally centered about 4 inches below bellybutton, but now moves around a bit.

        I'm only 4 hour from Philly, so considering calling Meyers. If I could, I would probably go to Munich.
        Frustrated, like everybody.
        Jeff
    • RunDaddy
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/21/2007 6:48AM - in reply to jeff55
      • RunDaddy
      • jeff55 wrote:
        Run Daddy, It was probably in an earlier post, but who did yours?

        After reading much of this thread, and hearing all the problems, I'm hoping that those who healed easily, whether with or without surgery, have happily gone on their way and are no longer heard from. Otherwise, the outlook is pretty bleak. I probably have an sh. I'm 55 years old, and a recreational soccer player and runner, but also a builder, so I still need my body for work. I think I had a mild sh 4 years ago that healed when I laid off of soccer for three months and did some pt. At that time I could run without pain, I just always felt like I had to urinate when I ran. Anybody had that symptom? This time it came on after I got too cranked up in a soccer game and did my first bicycle kick in many years. I felt just a little wierdness afterwards, but within a few days I was in real pain when I played. Gradually cut down my activity all fall, but never could get over it, so I tried 6 weeks of no running, biking (which usually doesn't hurt) or soccer. Mostly pain free, but I did get some pain even if I just walked three miles or more. My question is if anybody has any input on my specific symptoms:
        1. No tenderness or pain on external pressure anywhere.
        2. Pain usually isn't during exercise, but the next day it comes on, then gets worse the second day.
        3. After I abuse it and get pain, it is always 5 days until the pain goes away-always the same.
        4. Can bike moderate distance, but tried just a 1 1/2 mile run, and the pain was there the next day.
        5. Pain was originally centered about 4 inches below bellybutton, but now moves around a bit.

        I'm only 4 hour from Philly, so considering calling Meyers. If I could, I would probably go to Munich.
        Frustrated, like everybody.
        Jeff
        Jeff,
        Meyers did my surgery. I'm 5 1/2 weeks out and doing pretty well. It aches after I run for a few hours and bothers me a little when I sit up in bed, but very minor compared to where I was. The next day it's always fine and I seem to be improving each week. I am able to swim without any problems.
        Your symptoms sound like AP. Meyers will tell you he's identified 18 different syndromes under the AP umbrella, so not everyone has the same symptoms. The bottom line is you have recurring groin pain with exercise and no noticeable bulge. I would try to see Meyers.
        I was very impressed with Dr. Meyers and his whole staff. About 3 1/2 weeks out I had a minor infection at one end of the incision. I called Meyers' cell phone and he returned my call within 30 minutes. About 5 days later I was concerned that the infection wasn't getting better, so I snapped a photo of it and e-mailed it to him. He answered my e-mail 20 minutes later and it was 10 P.M. on a Sunday night!! I think the guy works 7 days a week. I don't think I've ever had a doctor so devoted to his patients, and he had probably seen well over a 100 folks since he saw me. I don't know how he keeps it all straight.
    • jeff55
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/22/2007 6:19AM - in reply to RunDaddy
      • jeff55
      • Run Daddy,
        I made an appt. with Meyers for four weeks from now. I'm an old guy, so someone might tnink, why bother with surgery? I'm ready to give up soccer, and could give up running if I have to, as long as I can still bike. But I think alot of other people on this thread will see when they get older that they at least want to be able to walk, hike, and climb a bit. I can't walk much over three miles without paying the next five days, and that's not acceptable. I'll see what he says.

        Keep us posted on your progress. You are sounding like a success story and we need more of those. I'm still hoping that the poeple on this thread don't represent a true cross section of those with the problem, because the ones who got better don't need to talk about it any more.

        One general question: Anybody out there who had no external tenderness? My sports doc is not sure about the AP diagnosis because he can press anywhere he wants and it doesn't hurt.

        Jeff
    • RunDaddy
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/22/2007 6:53AM - in reply to jeff55
      • RunDaddy
      • jeff55 wrote:
        Run Daddy,
        I made an appt. with Meyers for four weeks from now. I'm an old guy, so someone might tnink, why bother with surgery? I'm ready to give up soccer, and could give up running if I have to, as long as I can still bike. But I think alot of other people on this thread will see when they get older that they at least want to be able to walk, hike, and climb a bit. I can't walk much over three miles without paying the next five days, and that's not acceptable. I'll see what he says.

        Keep us posted on your progress. You are sounding like a success story and we need more of those. I'm still hoping that the poeple on this thread don't represent a true cross section of those with the problem, because the ones who got better don't need to talk about it any more.

        One general question: Anybody out there who had no external tenderness? My sports doc is not sure about the AP diagnosis because he can press anywhere he wants and it doesn't hurt.

        Jeff
        Jeff,
        Good luck with Dr. Meyers. I had absolutely no external tenderness. Zero. I could press on the area as hard as I wanted with no pain. One of the first Docs I saw could get a reaction when he pressed at the base of the Inguinal Canal, but it wasn't very painful and I'm not sure it had anything to do with AP.
    • not a doctor
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/22/2007 6:53AM - in reply to not a doctor
      • not a doctor
      • Well, I follow this thread quite a bit but don't post much because I'm NOT recommending surgery. I know that's not a popular opinion here so I don't post much.

        However, I am now about 99% pain free when I run. It has been 4 months of lifting and stretching 4 days per week and I have to say the results have been great. Most here will respond and say that I never had a sports hernia but my symptoms are identical to the other posts here. Back in December, I posted the exercises I was doing with success and I still do them today. The only thing I have not added back yet is speedwork - like 16 X 400 with 200 jog on the track. I have tried this but I am still sore the following day after a session where I lift/drive my knees. I am able to do 8 X 100 meter strides before every workout without a problem. It seems the longer, sustained, fast effort is what still aggravates my injury. So, I am not doing that. Most of my workouts have been steady running at threshold pace. For as long as I combatted this issue, I'm fine with running steady pace pain free.

        There is another guy at the gym that I go to regularly that is 53 years old, a runner, and has sports hernia symptoms. He has also tried the lifting routine that I gave him with success. However, he is only about 4 weeks into the routine and still has symptoms. He says his issues are one half as bad as they were 6 months ago. He is also running again.

        I am convinced there are other ways to attack this injury. And reading the recent posts where surgery has not helped the issue makes me happier that I've put it off thus far.
    • MTherniaguy
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/22/2007 7:36AM - in reply to not a doctor
      • MTherniaguy
      • Interesting. Thanks for sharing. Could you post your weekly strength training routine?
    • jamer
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/22/2007 12:16PM - in reply to not a doctor
      • jamer
      • Yes, I too would be interested in your strength and stretching routine. Not only did I suffer from a SH aka AP and had surgery I still don't feel it is 100% plus I know others who suffer. Being a trainer, track coach, martial arts and yoga instructor I am interested in what has worked for you. I have experimented with a lot of hip opening as well as core strength which does not generate much pulling.
        Please email me or find me thru my website at www.highmesafitness.com
    • not a doctor
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/22/2007 7:35PM - in reply to jamer
      • not a doctor
      • Actually, I posted it here about page 24 or so but it has changed a bit.

        First, I tested my strength by lying on my back, thigh perpendicular with the floor, lower leg parallel with the floor. Then had someone push my knees toward the floor (toward my feet) while I resisted and tried to pull my knee toward my chest. That showed me how week my left side was (compared to my right side). I could not even keep them from pushing my left leg down quickly.

        Once I got that, I was told by my physical therapist wife, that I should only lift until it hurt. Not 'through' the pain which is what I had been doing.

        So, the initial exercise was a knee drive, using this machine:
        http://www.freemotionfitness.c...nbr=116031

        I put my foot in the handle where most people put their hands and I drive my knees like a sprinter. If this hurts, use this exercise instead:
        Do knee lifts while body is vertical - however, you NEED to use some weight. Just using your leg is not enough resistance. For this exercise, I use a medicine ball (just a weighted ball) that I hold between my feet. Then I lft my feet together up until my upper leg is parallel with the floor. I have access to a machine where I can support my upper body while doing this.
        Next, I use a 'Slideboard' twice per week. A Slideboard is a highly polished flat surface that hockey players use to train in the winter. Search for it on the Internet to see what one looks like. Basically, it's a white board about 7 feet long. You wear 'booties' and slide yourself back and forth. I could not do this until I had lifted for about one month. This is very hard on the injury so be careful. However, I also believe this is one of the best exercises for this issue.

        Start with those. I did them for about 3 months before I added others.

        In addition to those exercises, I stretched a lot - still do and I stopped doing speedwork on the track. I am a competitive runner and am used to doing speedwork (on the track) 3 days per week.

        Stretches (twice per day, 20 minutes):
        A lunge with both hands raised straight up over your head. Back leg straight (not bent at the knee). Front leg lowered until thigh is almost parallel with the ground. It's important to 'push' your hip on the back leg forward - toward the front of your body.
        Sitting crossed legged. Sounds funny but I can barely sit Indian style.
        Spread legs as wide as possible and touch the ground. Again, I rarely stretch so this is difficult for me. This stretches the adductors. If it doesn't stretch your adductors, find a way to work on those.

        In addition to this, I used: ice twice a day, ibuprofen 3 X 800 mg for 10 days. I have actually done about 3 bouts of the ibuprofen.

        The other guy at my gym is lifting 45 minutes every other day. He is having success but it's going slowly. He is very happy that the pain has been reduced but it is NOT gone yet.

        More later. And I'll monitor this thread.

        My whole point in writing all of this is that I am willing to try anything before someone cuts me open. I was scheduled for hernia surgery on a Tuesday about 2 years ago. I had a social conversation with another doctor on Sunday, two days before surgery, and he said try this XXX (the stuff above). If it doesn't work, have the surgery. But what could it hurt to wait and try something else? Boy, am I glad I did! In those two years, I have dropped my mileage down (from the 80s - 90s area) to about 40 but I'm healthy so I don't care.
    • jeff55
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/23/2007 7:02AM - in reply to not a doctor
      • jeff55
      • not a doctor,
        you said some very interesting stuff. I went back and read your original post. Sounds like the location of your pain was quite different from mine. You said yours was very low, and on one side, whereas mine is mostly dead center, 4 inches or so below the belly button, 3 inches above my penis. Probably means your exercises wouldn't be right for me, but they might work for someone else.

        I was also interested that your physical therapist wife said not to stetch through the pain. My instinct (developed after many injuries) tells me that's right for this injury. But seven years ago when I tore my quadricep in a soccer game i spent months with pain. When I finally went to a pysical therapist, he had me stretch through the pain, and after two weeks of that it was completely gone. I still have a big, noticable divot missing right in the front of my thigh, but no surgery, and never any more pain.
        Jeff
    • not a doctor
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin", or & 3/23/2007 11:49AM - in reply to jeff55
      • not a doctor
      • Jeff,

        You're right. My pain was located on my left side. It started about 4 inches below my belly button and was irritating. After a few months of that, the pain - severe pain - moved to the left side very, very low. You could easily put your finger on it and to do that, you would press directly toward my head from under my groin area. It was still on the left side but very low, almost under the pubic bone.

        When I first went to the Dr due to the pain at the first site, they told me it was a hernia but you could not see it. I went to 5 Drs before all was said and done. In that time, the pain moved down to the lower section of my body. And this time, it was really, really severe. No coughing, certainly no sitting up in bed without using my arms to push myself up, no way could I do a sit-up, etc. I didn't feel the pain while walking around but anytime I contracted my abs, it was there.

        The second time I went through this whole thing. I strained my left adductor along with the other issues. That lasted for at least 2 months.

        I think these are all related.

        Lastly, if I said something in error, please forgive me. I have STRETCHED through pain and gotten relief. My wife told me not to LIFT weights through the pain. Initially, I was really straining and it hurt when I lifted. Then my wife changed that so I only lifted UNTIL it hurt. My stretching routine was never changed.

        To clarify, yes, I stretched through pain. No, I did not lift on severe pain.

        I am now running sub 5:00 miles on my steady runs - pain free. So, for me this has worked very well.

        Good luck
    • Runninbud
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/23/2007 1:34PM - in reply to RunDaddy
      • Runninbud
      • RunDaddy,
        I just scheduled my surgery with Meyers for next month. Any advice on the logistics for the actual surgery? What time did yours happen? How was the rest of the day post-op? Did you spend the night at the hospital? When did you actually get back on your feet? Did you need crutches ever? Anything else of interest or note or advice for the day prior or post to consider?

        Sorry for the barrage of questions. This will be my first ever surgery.
    • Jhonathin
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/23/2007 2:54PM - in reply to Runninbud
      • Jhonathin
      • Runninbud,
        I had surgery with Meyers 10 weeks ago, my first as well, and can share my experience. I had bilateral pelvic floor but did not have my adductors done. Overall it went very well. And i was by myself too so if you have someone with you it will only be easier. I was scheduled for surgery at 10:00 but didn't actually get in until 11:30 or so. I was in for about an hour. I woke up in the recovery room and the first thing i remember is shaking uncontrollably. It was painful because it made me tighten my abdominal muscles. My testacles were also quite sore and it felt like i was kicked in the balls. Expect them to be swollen for at least a week. The nurse gave me some morphine so that pain went away pretty quickly.

        Once i got into my room i was asleep most of the day. The most uncomfortable aspect of the whole experience was not having any control over my bladder. The nurse will probably tell you to fill up a urine jar within 6 hours or she'll catheterize you. You don't want that. I got up at least 6 or 7 times and tried to urinate before i actually could. It is so frustrating to feel the sensation of having to urinate and not be able to. Plus you're on your feet when you don't really want to be.

        The pain meds they provide are effective but you will definitely be sore. I didn't need crutches and i doubt you will either. Walking around for the first 24 hours is just going to be slow. I got up the morning after surgery and went straight to the airport without any difficulty. My advice is to follow their recommendation about walking as much as possible. For the first week i went out for about 20-30 minutes each night. I like to think it helped. I was back on my feet within two days. I was back to work five days after surgery.

        Good luck.
    • RunDaddy
      • RE: Anyone ever had a "Sports Hernia" aka: "Sportsman's hernia", "Gilmore's groin 3/24/2007 9:20AM - in reply to Runninbud
      • RunDaddy
      • Runninbud wrote:
        RunDaddy,
        I just scheduled my surgery with Meyers for next month. Any advice on the logistics for the actual surgery? What time did yours happen? How was the rest of the day post-op? Did you spend the night at the hospital? When did you actually get back on your feet? Did you need crutches ever? Anything else of interest or note or advice for the day prior or post to consider?

        Sorry for the barrage of questions. This will be my first ever surgery.
        Runninbud,
        Jhonathin capured a lot of the experience. Logistics for me were pretty easy. I took the train up from DC on a Thursday morning for an afternoon appointment. My appointment was at 3 but it was about 5 before I finally met with Dr. Meyers (I met with the resident about 4:15 or so). Meyers did the exam, looked at the MRI and came back in and told me I was a good candidate for the surgery. Then he explains what he does and answers any questions.
        The next morning I reported to teh hospital at 7 for in processing and sugery prep. I was very impressed at how efficien the whole thing was. By 9 I was in the pre-op room with about 5 other guys waiting for the surgery. Meyers came in and talked with everyone for a few minutes. He was like a conductor of a small orchestra, whirling around the room giving orders to all kinds of people. I was in the OR for about 40 minutes. When woke up I was in some pain, but they gave me some pain reliever through the IV and I fell back asleep for a bit.
        Once they moved me upstairs I wasn't feeling so bad. I ate lunch and visited with my Mom for a few hours, called my wife, etc.. I walked a bit before dinner. I fell asleep at about ten and only used 1 percocet. The thing I didn't know was I could have gone home the same day if I wanted. But, I had missed the last train so I stayed overnight. If you're lookig to reduce cost, this would be a good option. The guy in my room left the same day.
        You'll be really sore the next day and for a few days afterwards. I went to work on Monday because I am in a grad program and needed to get to class. I was pretty tired but managed ok.

        Good luck.

        RD