How does Adams State do it?

Started with coach Vigil. Continues with coach Martin.

Great coaching and tradition draws that level of talent, but let's be realistic about the obvious altitude advantages. There are no high altitude d1 programs of any prominence that I know of but there is at least one very strong middle-high altitude team (7-8k, NAU) and many fine middle-low (mile high) programs. No coincidence that Colorado wins so many national championships and BYU, UNM, and others are strong.

Altitude is a double edged sword. Tough to run 100 mile weeks in Alamosa or Gunnison in December, January and February.

Which makes them a lot tougher mentally.

LeadvilleNative wrote:

Altitude is a double edged sword. Tough to run 100 mile weeks in Alamosa or Gunnison in December, January and February.

Alamosa is an excellent place to train in the summer, which adds up for a great fall of XC. Anybody who's been to Alamosa will see why they are successful- nothing to do there but focus on running and school. Easy to recover, with all the flat open roads and trails in town. Drive to get hills. They've built a winning culture, and the success will continue as long as there's a will.

Also, lots of mileage. I don't know if it's still true, but it used to be that you had to show up before the season started and be able to run 10 mi. in 55:00 in Alamosa if you even wanted to train with the team.

jjjjjjjjj wrote:

Great coaching and tradition draws that level of talent, but let's be realistic about the obvious altitude advantages. There are no high altitude d1 programs of any prominence that I know of but there is at least one very strong middle-high altitude team (7-8k, NAU) and many fine middle-low (mile high) programs. No coincidence that Colorado wins so many national championships and BYU, UNM, and others are strong.

Not like CU has won that many titles. Since winning its first men's title in 2001 it has won 4 counting that one. Ok stats has 3, Stanford, WI, Oregon each have 2. Also CU is only school on men's side from Altitude to win EVER. (El Paso is under 4000 feet)

They have talent. And they have coaching.

Here's a breakdown of their top guys and what they ran before getting to Adams (HS or otherwise specified):

Kevin Batt- 14:04 5k

Tabor Stevens- 1:53 and 4:22 at altitude in HS

Jovanny Godinez- 9:53 2-mile in HS

Naseem Haje- 15:06/31:11 5k/10k in college

Kyle Masterson -4:25 HS miler

Julian Florez- 4:26 HS miler

Chandler Reid- 4:19 HS miler at altitude

They combine some talent, and a lot of hard work.

It's impressive. I think the altitude works to their advantage, as well as the tradition. And the fact that they have like like 30+ guys on the team!

I would also add in that they seem to know how to race best when it matters most. They looked very vulnerable after Griak and Conference. A lot of people said they wouldn't win and may even be third. Then they go out and win by 50 points. I was there watching. I saw one of their guys in tears after the race. They wanted that.

They didn't use to. Adams choked at nationals multiple times. Don't think it had to do anything with Martin though, there were a few individuals throughout those years that just couldn't put it together.

No one said they were going to be third, let's be real. Everyone knew it was between them and Western. Western decided not to show up so Adams blew everyone away.

Have to give credit where credit is due, don't forget, they lost a sub 14 guy before the season started. Pretty impressive. I think Adams ran as well as they could have except for maybe Batt. Which is saying something considering he was just outside the top 10.

D2machine wrote:

They didn't use to. Adams choked at nationals multiple times.

EVERY program has bad national meets. Western had one this weekend. I was surprised, as Coach Michel has done a tremendous job. I was disappointed that Adams and Western didn't go 1-2. Never want to lose to Western, but you gotta respect the men and women in red.

You don't have a combined (NAIA/D2) 22 national titles (plus 18 women's titles) if you don't know how to run well late in the year. I appreciate you saying that it likely wasn't coaching and I'm sure there have some occasions where the team underperformed, but it's been the exception.

Adams stepped up big. particularly their 4 and 5 guys. So much for a rebuilding year. Don't think anybody could have predicted what happened. I thought it would be way closer. They did it even with Kevin Batt having an extremely bad day. He was 2nd last year and usually beats Stevens.

As the other poster noted, their team was pretty "blue collar". Talented guys who have improved significantly since they started. No over-aged foreigners to speak of. The usual complaints against Adams don't really hold water here.

I don't know how they do it. We would all have go to Alamosa to find out.

There are old threads with alum detailing their training.

Basically, they work their a**es off, but do it intelligently.

Lots of hills.

Lots of miles.

More hills.

More miles.

Smart VO2 and threshold training.

It isn't ground-breaking stuff. They just f***ing work.

I went to a good D2 school and worked as hard and as smart as I knew how, but I don't think I ever worked on their level. I wish I could spend a season with them and experience it. So much respect for what they do.

Read Vigil's book. It's pretty telling. The training charts are noticeably faster and higher volume than other books for similar type workouts. For example, table 8-4 for emerging marathoners calls for 120 mile weeks. 8-5 for experienced marathoners calls for 140. Pfitzinger/Douglas Advanced marathoning calls for 55 at the low end, and 95 at the high end. And there are numerous threads on this site that will tell you that Pfitzinger is too tough, and will lead to injury.

fasdfasdf wrote:

There are old threads with alum detailing their training.

Basically, they work their a**es off, but do it intelligently.

Lots of hills.

Lots of miles.

More hills.

More miles.

Smart VO2 and threshold training.

It isn't ground-breaking stuff. They just f***ing work.

I went to a good D2 school and worked as hard and as smart as I knew how, but I don't think I ever worked on their level. I wish I could spend a season with them and experience it. So much respect for what they do.

Thank you, I will do that. I didn't realize Vigil had a book out. I've read Pfitzinger's and found it pretty straightforward. I've always thought more work could be handled but have no idea how to do it. Vigil might be what I need...

And they have EPO.

They put one foot in front of the other, and some of their guys do so very quickly.

Yes a small Division II school in the middle of God knows where Colorado has access to EPO. The ignorance that people bring to this message board. How about instead of being a sour apple about a program that is better than the one your associated with you find a way to get better rather than accusing a group of college kids who work there tail off to be great runners of doing EPO.

Not sure which is more ridiculous. The idea that Adams might be using EPO or the idea that they couldn't have access to EPO because they are in a remote area.