So I just had a terrible junior year in terms of running, am I screwed for college recruiting?

One thing I forgot to add, right before I got anemia, I was in really really good shape, I was running workouts that suggested I was capable of about 4:20. But, I didn't get to race during this time. I think if I hadn't gotten anemia, I could have ran 4:15-4:17 by the end of the season, but I know that I can't expect to get recruited by telling coaches what I thought that I could have done.

Any college coach worth his salt tagged you off your soph time

If he's local he'll find out about your anemia

Have you gotten any letters yet??

If not shame on those local college coaches

Make a list of schools you'd prefer, contact them, explain your situation

What state are you from

best of Luck in '14

Though I'd expect you'll get a hard time from some who respond, I'll try to answer your question(s) seriously.

Ivy coaches are aware that "things happen" during high school, and your 4:25 as a soph will tell them that you have some potential. You're right: a big song and dance about how things went for you as a junior will not help! If you have to say *anything* about it, keep it to "tough year--got sick" or something similar. Some further notes:

--As a guy, you can get cut some slack for a bad junior year (though you'll have to "redeem" yourself with a very good cross season); a girl in a similar situation would be likely to get written off ("Oh, she must have matured physically").

--Even running 4:25 as a soph doesn't really separate you from a lot of other guys. Yes, 4:17 or so as a junior would have helped, but might not have put you at or near the top of some Ivy coaches' lists.

--If your grades (and class rank/test scores?--you didn't mention those) are truly just "pretty good," they would only be good enough if you were at, or approaching, a top national HS level--at least for admission at Harvard, and likely at Penn. A coach would have to "burn" one of his/her very few "big breaks from Admissions" to get someone with such academic stats into school.

Yale is in a different situation, as I understand it: athletically, they might have more use for a 4:25-as-a-soph guy; but they seem to get fewer admission breaks, too. I believe other Ivies (e.g. Cornell) *might* be a little more accommodating.

[This assumes that your grades/tests/rank were *actually* "pretty good," and that you weren't just being extremely modest.

[It also assumes that your ethnicity is some flavor of European or Asian. An African/Latin American background would be a whole different ballgame.]

--Whether for the Ivies or for a lot of other quality academic colleges, a good summer and fall of running will help a lot, as you've already figured out. Try the Summer of Malmo (use the Search function or Google, if you're not familiar with it), but paying *particular* attention to keeping well within yourself when doing the faster work. Summer running should be fun, a chance to get some good miles in and train with others, not a grim-death affair.

--I'm guessing you have a few weeks of school left this semester. Study like a madman, work hard on your assignments, and get *really* good grades for this semester--they'll help with admissions anywhere. And if your standardized-test scores so far have been anything less than stellar, schedule some test prep before your next round of those exams. If you have the discipline, use prep books on your own (you can probably get some from the public library); otherwise, consider a test-prep course.

[Full disclosure: after my track-coaching career, I worked for Kaplan for several years.]

--If you haven't already, get in touch *now* with the coaches of the top-academic colleges you're interested in. Don't wait until you have a great xc season! As I say, some will be interested based just on that soph 4:25; and the degree to which coaches respond to your contacting them now, may give you a clue to how interested they are in you.

--In any case, DON'T "give up." For the next twelve months study, run, and prep for tests as though you expected to be admitted everywhere. In 20+ years of college coaching, including in the Ivy League, I've seen too many admissions surprises (both good and bad) to be able to predict anyone's admission chances very accurately.

Sorry for the long post. I don't have time to shorten it.

Good luck. Please bump this thread occasionally and keep us posted on developments.

Similar thing happened my senior year...got hurt/sick every season. I think worst case you find somewhere you can walk on and prove yourself at the school of your choice. If you can get in on academic merit, I'm sure you can find an ivy that'll take a guy who's run 4:25 as a sophomore. The thing is, once you get into a school, everyone is on a level playing field. If you're legit, you get to race whether you're a walk-on or full ride. And the best part is, you get the benefit of chasing those guys who were recruited. Every time people start dropping off in a workout, you'll have that much more motivation. So hang in there and crush this last year and I think you'll be in good shape for an excellent college career.

Thanks for the thoughtful response. A few more specifics about my academics- I had a 3.1 freshman year, but I have a 3.8 now, taking hard classes. I got 2110 on the SAT, I think that's about as good as its gonna get. I'm fairly sure next year that ill be able to get a weighted GPA above 4.0, I'm going for 4.2-4.4. I'm just confused because I've heard so many different things on how track plays into recruiting at ivies. For example, I knew a guy who got into brown with a 3.6 at a big public school with not particularly hard classes (I go to a prep school btw) 1950 SAT and a 4:22 and 1:58 his junior year, and a 15:42 5k in xc his senior year. I think the only other thing he had going for him was that his mom went there. Since you said you were an Ivy League coach, does this sound particularly unusual?

We all know some dumb people who ran for Ivies. Depends on the coach and the AD how much weight running will have on your application.

Just focus on getting healthy and getting good grades. Some coaches will be wack, some will give you a boost. Can't control who does what, but with your transcript it's safe to say you'll get into some good schools.

Repeat your junior year. One more year will seem small if you can parlay it into Ivy.

call the coaches your interested in... give them your best times... if your closing in 57 in a 1600 still running 4:25 they'll at least give you a look I would think...

It sounds a little unusual to me, but not rare; and having his mom as a Brown alum (and perhaps--just speculation--a generous alum) might have made a tremendous difference. I can tell you that my sister-in-law, about 25 years ago, got into Harvard with a 1300s SAT--and an academically-prominent alumnus dad--with no help from the Athletic Department; but I was under the impression that that sort of legacy admission was rarer nowadays. (She graduated magna, btw--like most other Cantabs I've known.)

I was a little confused by your saying that you "have a 3.8 now"--is that cumulative, or just what you've gotten this year? (Either way, that kind of upward trend will help you a lot; but if you've brought a 3.1 cume up to a 3.8 cume, that would be spectacular!) For anyone with a good upward trend in GPA, a key is to apply fairly early in the admission cycle. Maybe not the first possible week--that's when the eager-beaver types, with their 4.42 GPAs and 2380 SATS, will send in the apps that they filled out months before--but still pretty early, enough so that your improvement, and the LORs that support it, will be able to get a decent look.

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As other posters have suggested, things vary a lot from year to year, even with a given coach remaining at a given college, based on the coach's perception of what event(s) will need shoring up.

For example, I know of one team that didn't put in much effort recruiting middle-distance folks, because it was loaded in that area; just a year later, between injuries/illness and one or two people leaving the team/school, it was suddenly bereft in those events. That year, I'd bet they used a lot of their admissions "pull" for middle-distance recruits.

The point is that it's really hard to know, in a given year, how "attractive" even a very good athlete will look, and how much of a coach's boost for admissions s/he's likely to receive.

[That boost can even be the deciding factor in a slightly-dicey (academically speaking) kid's being admitted; but the coaches, and their admission departments, will typically reserve that kind of effort for the very, very top recruits--and, given that the Ivy League teams are constantly becoming more competitive at a national level, that might mean kids who are in the top 10-20 of their event, nationwide.]

So you need to get in touch with Ivy coaches early, to get a read on their potential interest; and you need to apply widely, as well as fairly early.

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I'll say this: the League is a great conference in which to compete (and coach). There are fierce rivalries, but the camaraderie and bonhomie among Ivy students is outstanding. And the Ivy championship meets (aka the Heptagonals) are perhaps the most exciting, and probably the best-attended, collegiate meets that I've ever seen.