We make 250,000/year. I'm not a f***ing billionaire

Jeff: So you're barely keeping up on $250,000 per year. How on earth does a family making a fraction of that survive (since the median household income in the United States is about one eighth of your annual earnings)?

Okay Jeff, try to keep up. $250,000 per year AFTER...and I did repeat that in the first post...AFTER taxes is abt. $139,000 per year. Got a kid in college? There's about $50,000 right there. Got 2 in college? Got younger ones? Ever reached the "donut hole" in medicare when caring for elderly parents? Pay property taxes and other state and local taxes? And now here's the math for you: $139.000 does not equal 1 million. And I can easily tell you how a family making a fraction of that amount survives. I've done it. Lost my home as a child twice. Got a work permit to start working at a very early age and couldn't do homework until jobs were done. And now, as an adult, I get laid off every now and then--nothing I can do about that. But there are times when we will have at least 3 full times jobs between us in the family, and I can clean apartments on the weekends for $10 per hour, and we make it. At the end of the day, I can hardly see straight. But my parents who are nearing the end of their lives have everything they need in terms of medical care and love, and my kids who have worked so hard academically and in their employment will go on to be of service to others--to make a real change in the lives of others. One thing they and I will never do is to finger point or cast uncaring, sarcastic comments at anyone who works this hard for all the right reasons. I count my blessings everyday because I could be laid off again at any time, and one way or the other, since I have no funds left to contribute to other organizations, I donate my time to help others in need, and that, my friend, is true wealth.

Seriously? Audacity? So you've met me and my family? You've lived with us? Gone to work with me? I've gotten by on a lot less then 60k, my friend, but I didn't have the sole financial and physical care of elderly parents AND college aged kids. Yeah--I have a big spending problem. I add up the groceries in the cart before I hit the checkout stand. I pull the gas pump out of the car before it reaches $40 dollars because that's the budget. You can throw figures and percentages out all you want, but it won't change reality. So walk a mile in my shoes--you wouldn't last 2 minutes. You can't handle a family working that many jobs and that many hours and never seeing a penny of it? You could care less that nearly half those paychecks go to the government? Then that's you're problem. A little more compassion and a lot less hysterical finger pointing would do you well. Now who needs to get over themselves? Reality may not agree with you, but you can't change it.

And Latrell Sprewell said $7 million a year wasn't enough to feed his kids.

You're choosing to pay $50,000 per year on tuition. You've put yourself in that hole.

Also, what are your dependent claims? I would think that, even in New York, your net pay would be closer to $160,000.

Sure. Latrell and I hang out together all the time. In the meantime, you obviously don't have kids in college, and haven't checked tuition rates, dorm, food, books, travel, etc. They get excepted where they get excepted, especially if they've worked hard, as I tried to point out to you, but that went over your head as well. No offense, but I'd be laughing right now if I weren't so tired. So higher education is a "hole for you?" From your comments, I guess that's to be expected. Nonetheless, net pay is just under $139,000, Jeff, and there isn't a thing you or I can do about it. And, as we both know, it's going to go 'way down very soon, and we can't do anything about that either. So where is your bitterness and denial coming from?

$139k after taxes on $250k? You are paying over 40% in federal taxes? What you are you contacting us from? 1959?

Oh dear Samolea, I'll break it down for you. State taxes are currently at 9.3%, and federal taxes are currently at 35%. That equals 44.3 %, and they're about to go a lot higher. That would be the 21st century--please join us there.

What I do love is that no matter what income most people bring in, there's always time for complaints about not having enough...while not thinking for a second about all the money they sink into "needing" the latest Apple gadgets, etc.

Any conversation that fails to address the regional differences in cost of living is flawed. Studies have shown that it is quite possible for one family pulling in $175k to be better off than the family pulling in $250k.

Finally--an intelligent comment. Thank you for pointing out regional differences. I doubt most people will understand what you're talking about, but you are right. I also agree about people complaining that they need the latest gadget--it's amazing. Living simply is so much easier. Thanks for your comment.

FedUp wrote:

Sure. Latrell and I hang out together all the time. In the meantime, you obviously don't have kids in college, and haven't checked tuition rates, dorm, food, books, travel, etc. They get excepted where they get excepted, especially if they've worked hard, as I tried to point out to you, but that went over your head as well. No offense, but I'd be laughing right now if I weren't so tired. So higher education is a "hole for you?" From your comments, I guess that's to be expected. Nonetheless, net pay is just under $139,000, Jeff, and there isn't a thing you or I can do about it. And, as we both know, it's going to go 'way down very soon, and we can't do anything about that either. So where is your bitterness and denial coming from?

That's fine that you choose to pay for it. Good for you. Good for your kid. But don't act like that's a basic necessity when 99% of the country gets on without it. Your kid could have gone to a public university and gotten student loans like most everyone else. But you didn't choose that. And that's fine. But it's a choice you make.

Wrong again. If a family "looks to good on paper" you can kiss student loans goodbye. And if you're not accepted to a public university, you really can't attend, now can you? So there goes your "choice theory," but you never answered where your bitterness and denial are coming from. Maybe read Johnny's comment and that may give you some insight into your troubles.

P.S. Please do a little research before commenting again. 99% of undergraduate students do not attend public universities. The current figure is between 16 to 18% of all U.S. undergraduate students are in attendance at private universities, and that's not counting undergrads who attend out of the country. You seem to be really stuck on (incorrect) percentages. Add that to the previous questions I've asked you, and see if you can answer just one.

Are you asking me about my own selfish greed, or what's best for the country as a whole?If I cash a bond in later, who pays for it? My children, and yours. They will have to pay what I borrowed plus interest. How does it make sense to obligate future generations to provide the current government the "cash to pay for something extra"?

X-Runner wrote:

There is another way to look at the US debt.

Most of the debt is Americans lending money to the US.

Or you can say mostly Americans investing in the US.

Say the US is looking for cash to pay for something extra.

They could tax you and have no debt.

Or borrow the money from you and incur debt.

You would rather loan them your money and get US bonds that you can redeem later then pay extra taxes that you won't get back. Wouldn't you?

Even an investment that yields zero interest is better than giving your money away.

So, the other side of debt is the building of wealth for individuals.

FedUp wrote:

Wrong again. If a family "looks to good on paper" you can kiss student loans goodbye. And if you're not accepted to a public university, you really can't attend, now can you? So there goes your "choice theory," but you never answered where your bitterness and denial are coming from. Maybe read Johnny's comment and that may give you some insight into your troubles.

FedUp Jr. couldn't go to junior college for two years and then transfer to the state school?

FedUp wrote:

P.S. Please do a little research before commenting again. 99% of undergraduate students do not attend public universities.

Yeah. I know that. Perhaps I need to be clearer: my contention was that 99% of US undergrad students aren't having their parents write a personal check for their private university tuition. And by "99%" I mean the vast majority. I welcome data to prove me wrong.

That's exactly what I did, and what 2 of my kids did as well. You're not taking into consideration the fiscal responsibility of supporting elderly parents, property taxes, or other variables. And who in their right mind would pull a kid out of college or kick a parent to the curb so they could have the honor of giving up more than nearly half their paycheck. You're really obsessing over the net income. Now, why are you unable to answer even one question. I'd be interested to know where your bitterness and denial are coming from. And truthfully--without sarcasm. Every comment can be a learning experience.

FedUp wrote:

Oh dear Samolea, I'll break it down for you. State taxes are currently at 9.3%, and federal taxes are currently at 35%. That equals 44.3 %, and they're about to go a lot higher. That would be the 21st century--please join us there.

Your entire income is not taxed at the highest rate. In fact, only income above $388,350 is taxed at the highest rate. I am pretty sure that $250k is less than $388,350. Your federal income overall rate, if in fact you are making $250k, is probably around 26%.

What state do you live in that has a 9.3% income tax rate? I looked in to it and the answer is none, on $250k. You need to be making a lot more than that and then your income tax rate might approach 9.3% in Hawaii, Cali, Oregon,or Rhode Island.

The facts show quite clearly that you are a liar.

Honey, check the tax charts again. And name calling won't get you anywhere. A little class and tact couldn't hurt.

FedUp wrote:

Oh dear Samolea, I'll break it down for you. State taxes are currently at 9.3%, and federal taxes are currently at 35%. That equals 44.3 %, and they're about to go a lot higher. That would be the 21st century--please join us there.

Wow, are you really that stupid?? No, you are clearly a right wing clown troll. I just looooved your sob story of working part time jobs cleaning apartments (was that it?) for 10$ an hour to supplement your 1/4 of a million $ family salary, that was a nice touch, though over the top. And then of course caring for your elderly parent. But let me guess, you support republicans who want to dismantle medicare/medicaid/Obamacare, so you can pay MORE to take care of your sick, elderly parent? Hilarious.

So, after taxes and paying tuition, it sounds like you calculations are: you've got nothing left! You are in completely in debt from those things alone? Puh-leaze. This is from an article actually supporting you case that you are already taxed too much, but finding *slightly* different numbers than you:

"At the $250,000 income level that is at the center of President Obama’s tax increase proposal, up to 55% ($139,133) of the $250,000 families earn goes to taxes and what they are expected to contribute toward the cost of college each year.

After paying $73,696 in federal, state (Pennsylvania), local and FICA taxes, parents with a household income of $250,000 are expected under the federal college aid formula to contribute an additional $65,437 per year toward the cost of college. "

(clearly if you have several other kids in school, you can get financial aid.)

So...... you are claiming that nearly 1/2 of your income goes to taxes, while this guy, who supports some of your complaints, calculates that currently WELL LESS THAN 1/3 of of your income goes to "federal, state (Pennsylvania), local and FICA taxes". hmmm... Did you forget that ONLY the amounts you earn that put you in the higher tax brackets are what gets hit with the higher tax rates, and not YOUR ENTIRE INCOME....YOU DUMMY?! Or did you figure no one was paying attention and you could create a fake sob story? Typical right wing clown troll, making shit up to try and make a case.

And did you further forget (ignore) that you qualify for financial aid beyond a certain amount of tuition, and that you are not expected to shell out 250,000 a year in tuition if you have 5 kids in college while only earning 250,000 a year??

Stop being either an idiot or a right wing troll without a clue about taxes or Obama's proposals or anything else.

FedUp wrote:

That's exactly what I did, and what 2 of my kids did as well. You're not taking into consideration the fiscal responsibility of supporting elderly parents, property taxes, or other variables. And who in their right mind would pull a kid out of college or kick a parent to the curb so they could have the honor of giving up more than nearly half their paycheck. You're really obsessing over the net income. Now, why are you unable to answer even one question. I'd be interested to know where your bitterness and denial are coming from. And truthfully--without sarcasm. Every comment can be a learning experience.

Why is it so hard for you to understand what I am saying?

I don't begrudge you for paying for your kids' tuition, owning a house of any worth, supporting your aging relatives, etc. It's your money and you earned it. Spend it how you like. I don't care.

What pisses me off is when someone claims that it's tough to get by on a quarter of a million dollars per year before taxes. You understand that the vast majority of everyone else somehow manages to raise a family and care for a family on a fraction of the income. Because if it's a struggle on $250,000 per year (or $140,000 net), how on god's green earth does everyone else take care of their parents, have children that go to college, put food on the table, etc.?