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anonomie me
Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/15/2012 11:18PM Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
First, there is no official record.

Second, many D1 schools count your performances in the summer before you graduate.

It is a unique situation, in that track has both a college season and an open season.

Centrowitz's time is superior, and he was representing the USA via Oregon at the date of his superior time. He enrolled in classes in the fall -- and only after that -- decided that in a Olympic year that his best strategy was to turn pro and start prepping for the Trials.

The NCAA makes a ton off of the backs of athletes (NCAA) there really is no need to punish a Centrowitz for making a career decision - pre-season, after the last season was completed (when he ran his "record" time.)

It's a goofy situation.

The fastest collegiate time ever run is Centrowitz's.

You can be sure that his time will be considered Oregon's school record -- as he was still a student and pre-pro.

The colleges help fund our Olympic development program with track and field scholarships... IF you are a fan of the sport...can you really say that you would rather see Centrowitz's time Not Honored / Acknowledged...just because of how screwed up both the NCAA and USATF are??

Not to mention the anomaly that is our sport?

Centrowitz ran in good faith at the NCAA's last year, and qualified for and won the USATF title last year, in good faith, and qualified to continue his season at the WC's and as part of that prep, that NCAA Athlete honored the NCAA and his school by winning a bronze medal at world's.

Oh, and btw, since the NCAA doesn't keep such records...only TFN does... TFN is then self anointed to make the rules?

TFN is not some hallowed institution...it is just a magazine run by some track geek geezers who do their best to do...as they see fit... That doesn't mean their decision should be considered the be all and end all.

With TFN's standard, and the standard of other posters here... An NCAA student could run a 3:34.59 in July...and that would not count as NCAA record, per TFN's decision.

Let's just make it simple.

We all know that last "track season," for the purposes of any NCAA track athlete, was BOTH the NCAA meets and any World meets they could be good enough to qualify for.

THAT is how it plays out in real life...if I run well enough during my college season, then I get to keep running at USA's and if I place in the top 3 there, I get to run in DL meets and at World's.

So now we are going to neglect a kid's accomplishment....simply because of the anomalies of our sports realities and schedules?

Let's not be so fast to give Kyle Merber "the record." His accomplishment is great, and thrilling, a great surprise and inspiring etc.

But, let's not forget that Centrowitz's time was funded mostly by his NCAA scholarship.

Let's not punish an athlete for excelling ahead of schedule and then being faced with an unexpected set of circumstances (staying in college or training for the Olympics.)
Dr. Mantis Toboggan
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 12:15AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
If an athlete runs a great time it will be remebered, no matter what. Even if they don't meet the bullshit criteria.
Reality Czech
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 12:43AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
So, Centrowitz's time was better than Ryun's? Am I missing something???
anonomie me
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 12:54AM - in reply to Reality Czech Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

Reality Czech wrote:

So, Centrowitz's time was better than Ryun's? Am I missing something???


Step away from the Beer and it will all become clear to you...
coach d
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 1:07AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
What is clear is that it's time to take out the Oregon trash (again).

In 1967, Ryun was NCAA champion in the mile...AND broke the WR(s) in the half mile, mile, and 1500 (3:33.1).

Either Ryun's time is the collegiate record, or Merber's time is. Both are faster than what Centrowitz ran under equivalent rules.
casual commentary
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 2:25AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
If the season doesn't matter like you're saying, wouldn't Andrew Wheating's 3:30.9 be the school record? He was still at Oregon the following fall IIRC.
The Waterboy
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 4:34AM - in reply to casual commentary Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

casual commentary wrote:

If the season doesn't matter like you're saying, wouldn't Andrew Wheating's 3:30.9 be the school record? He was still at Oregon the following fall IIRC.


Hadn't he already turned Pro at that point?
Linsanity
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 6:45AM - in reply to The Waterboy Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
LetsRun.....Put up something with no research like "Merber runs American Collegiate Record!!"

Actually do research and take it down the next day.
My Rules
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 7:43AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Here is my definition of a collegiate record:

You have to be wearing your school uniform and be representing your school.
ACR back to Merber.
Centrowitz was not wearing an Oregon singlet when he ran his PR.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qCYohbcLa3I

And he got smoked.

Here is Ryun's 3:33.1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gr3j2IxHuWU

Doesn't look like a Kansas singlet.
been here before
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 8:46AM - in reply to My Rules Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
This comes up all the time on here when these type of records are set (see: Lisa Koll's 5k record a few years ago run in July). It is an NCAA record if it is run in your college jersey and done on July 31 or before following your senior season. If it is Aug. 1 or after following your senior season, then it doesn't count. Obviously you can't have a pro contract or have signed with an agent when you run it, because you are ineligible as an NCAA athlete in that situation.
JustSayingSomething
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 8:47AM - in reply to My Rules Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

My Rules wrote:

Here is my definition of a collegiate record:

You have to be wearing your school uniform and be representing your school.


I hadn't thought of using that as a criteria but ... I like it. It's simple and easy to evaluate. Got my vote.
Outside the Lines
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 9:49AM - in reply to JustSayingSomething Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Would a sophomore/junior who is red-shirting not be eligible for an ACR?
JustSayingSomething
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 9:55AM - in reply to Outside the Lines Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

Outside the Lines wrote:

Would a sophomore/junior who is red-shirting not be eligible for an ACR?


Going by the "uniform/representing school" standard, someone redshirting would not be eligible for the ACR.

Redshirting means you are sitting out a season of collegiate competition, and so it doesn't really add up that you could not be competing collegiately but still set a college record.

Again, the proposed "uniform" standard is arbitrary, but it's clear and seems to capture much of what it means to be "collegiate".
My Rules
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 10:08AM - in reply to JustSayingSomething Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Right.
My idea prevents someone from having 5 years to get a record.
The "anyone who is in college rule" would let a red shirt run fast in the summer and get the record.

All I did was word the Track and Field News rule differently.
They say it has to be in the college season.
I say they have to wear the uniform and represent the school.
That only happens during the college season.
I guess they can wear their school uniform but not be entered by their school. Gray area. I'd say not record elligile.
CoreyIhmels
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 10:16AM - in reply to Outside the Lines Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Didn't Betsy Saina just beat Koll's 10k record but it didn't count because she is redshirting?
Brett
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 10:20AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
How many people are buying the Anonomie Me Recordbook? From where does your authority come?
26mi235
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 10:26AM - in reply to My Rules Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
So you can never set a collegiate record when you are representing your country, even if it is in the middle of the collegiate season and you are competing as a collegiate?
Jayhawk
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 10:26AM - in reply to Brett Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Ryun was competing for the national team so of course he wasn't wearing his national uniform. But you could probably take a split from his 3:51.1 when I'm pretty sure he did have his Kansas uniform on and it would be faster than Merber's time.
whatevsyo
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 10:46AM - in reply to anonomie me Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Does anyone outside letsrun really give a damn? Hell i visit letsrun and this is a ridiculous arguement. They all ran fast what more needs to be discussed.
spell check
RE: Kyle Merber 3:35.59 is NOT the American Collegiate Record 5/16/2012 11:10AM - in reply to whatevsyo Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

whatevsyo wrote:

Does anyone outside letsrun really give a damn? Hell i visit letsrun and this is a ridiculous arguement. They all ran fast what more needs to be discussed.


argument
arguement looks kind of douchey

oh, and what's your 10K time?
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