Anyone know anything other than he was a Lydiard disciple?
Anyone know anything other than he was a Lydiard disciple?
Very low mileage. One long run per week 10-12 miles, one longer interval session (6x800), one shorter interval session (4x400) or the Oregon 400,600,400,200, the rest was easy running as little as three miles some days.
-Doubles most days, except one day a week in which a long run is done.
-The schedules I've seen, his runners did all kinds of different interval workouts. Sets of 600,400,300,200,100; 300s; 6 x 1 mile, all kinds of combinations.
-A workout might go, some intervals, an easy run, and then some cutdowns (e.g., 3 x 300 each run progressively faster).
-For interval workouts his runners ran date pace and goal pace. The date pace intervals became progressively faster as the athlete progressed. A mile time trial was used to determine progress. Goal pace intervals were run at goal pace.
-About three days of interval training per week were done most of the year, I don't know about summer though.
-Distance was ran on the other days.
-Some people refer to his system as hard easy because of the interval days (interval days followed by easy distance) , but I've read that this isn't accurate. Some of the interval days weren't real hard. The number of easy days was dependent on the athlete.
A schedule might be:
M. a.m distance
p.m. fartlek
T. a.m. distance (perhaps some 100s)
p.m. intervals
W. a.m. distance
p.m. distance
Th. a.m. distance (perhaps some 100s)
p.m. intervals
F. a.m. easy run
p.m. easy run
S. Race, time trial or intervals
S. Long run 12-15 miles
Okay. That's almost exactly what Dellinger did, with variations of course. Thanks.
dont know if it is more dellinger but alot of the mixing of vo2 and lactate tolerance i.e. 6 x 800m(vo2 pace) + 200m(1500m pace) or variations of that. also the oregon circuit training of strides and drills mixed into body weight training.
This is more of a Dellinger program. Bowerman did vary the program to the athlete. Kenny Moore would go long (20-30 miles) two easy days of 20 minute runs and then hard (6x mile), two more easy days of 20 minute runs, hard (20x400) two more easy days of 20 minute runs and then long again.
True! Bill B. adjusted the workouts according to each runner's needs. The basics of his program included intervals, fartlek, hills, or longer runs at moderate to somewhat hard paces. The quantity varied according to a runner's ability to adapt. Two four minute milers on the same team would probably run no more than one workout per month the same.
Dyrol Burleson, who never lost a collegiate mile race, two-time NCAA mile champion, might run numerous 330-220-110 workouts and an occassional 10 x 440. He ran a 10-14 mile run once per week. Another runner, like Bill Dellinger, might run 440-660-440-200 x 3 sets. Another day Dellinger might run 3 x 1320 and 3 x 1 mile or 6 x 880 for endurance and aerobic capacity, though it wasn't called such names.
The off-season was not overly interval laiden as many people think. Bill B. knew that fartlek running was not only effective but a great way to decrease the number of injuries that runners, especiallty middle distance runners, often experience under a frequent interval program. In the autumn and early winter months weekly fartlke sessions on a golf course or up at Hendrick's Park were done. Hendricks, by the way, is super hilly.
People do not understand the Date-Pace, Goal-Pace approach of Bill Bowerman. The Date-Pace idea is grand, but often people think that it means you run a time trial at 100% effort. Not so! In fact, you run at 3/4th effort for about 3 laps or a little over and then run fast/sprint to the finish. A 4:00 miler in the off-season may be capable of running 4:16 all-out, but in his date-pace time trial he might run 4:32, for instance because the first three laps were run at a pace more similar to an all-out 2-mile run before he sprinted to the finish. So, date-pace intervals were run at 68 second pace in the early season or off-season. Over the months the date-pace time would drop (about a second per lap per month).
Goal pace workouts in the off season or early season were not tough. In fact, most of them were brief and the intervals wer not long. An example might be 4 x 220 at mile goal pace before the rest of the intervals in the workouts were done at date-pace. One might follow the 4 x 220s at goal pace with 2 or 3 sets of 44-660-440-220. Make sense?
During the spring, after doing such workouts for several months, the length and volume of the goal pace intervals would be higher and constitute a larger portion of the total quality running done per week. Still, many of the intervals were not hammered but run at date pace; now a faster date pace do to improved functional capacity of each runner (they were in better shape in the spring than in the autumn). Tinman
What Tinman says seems right, but I'd add one very important thing to it. For most runners, Bowerman prescribed a hard day followed by an easy day. Often the hard days were extremely tough. I remember Kenny Moore (and this goes back more than thirty years ago) describing one such week. There were four easy days of between four and six miles run quite slowly. One of the hard days was a run between twenty and thirty miles at a decent clip; another day was something like 6x1,320 at 5-10k pace, followed by a six to ten mile hard run, followed by 8x110 fast; the third day would be an hour and a half fartlek. Moore joked about seeing runners exhausting themselves every day, while he and the Oregon runners would be doing that only a few days a week. But I should say that what made Bowerman such a great coach was his astonishing ability to judge each runner's needs. He had this incredible insight. And his runner's had unquestioned confidence in his ability to guide them properly.
This is not exactly on topic, but on the Bowerman thread. There is an obscure book I read by an individual living in Hawaii called "Running BY Feeling" by Brian Clarke. He ran for Bowerman for a few years in the 60's while Moore was there. 3/4 of the book is about his running comeback using heart rate training in the 90's, but the other 1/4 is stories from his days at Oregon and they are very entertaining. I reread them often. I believe the book was on Amazon and may still be, but I emailed him directly for the book and he has a training website. I do not have the link you will have to do a search.
brian is a good guy. try his book
Your comments on Bowermans training fit nicly in with my own experience with Bill. I will like to comment on two aspects of his coaching that I think are essential to his success but also for understanding his thinking.
He was very careful with work that involved much lactate. In all hard sessions he wanted the athletes to finish strong but not staggering on stiff legs that could nearly move. Two things that helped him achieve this was the use of day-pace and goal pace and the other part is his presence on the track controlling efforts. He stopped runner who ran to fast gave them a jogging break and told them to start off on a slower pace if he thought it was needed. This was one aspect of his idea of tailoring the training to the needs of the individual. I do not have any great knowledge of training in US outside Oregon in the 70?s but I have the impression that this way of working the athletes was unique in the US at Bill's time.
He was as mentioned a believer in fartlek running. These are often described as easy runs. Bill was very aware and in many ways encouraged some of us to run some of these runs in a solid pace. These were runs between two sets of interval work in one session. Some of us we put in a major part of our training effort on these runs. This way he achieved some good work on running strength and some controlled racepace running in one session. By keeping the baserunning solid he made sure the athlete did not peak to early by putting to much into the faster stuff.
I have never heard Bill explain these aspects of his coaching in any detail and have never seen them described in books were Bill?s work is mentioned. They also makes Bowerman?s coaching hard copy or to categorize as Lydiard-based, interval-based or whatever.
I do however think they are essential to understanding the logic behind Bowerman?s programs.
KnutK
Your comments on Bowermans training fit nicly in with my own experience with Bill. I will like to comment on two aspects of his coaching that I think are essential to his success but also for understanding his thinking.
He was very careful with work that involved much lactate. In all hard sessions he wanted the athletes to finish strong but not staggering on stiff legs that could nearly move. Two things that helped him achieve this was the use of day-pace and goal pace and the other part is his presence on the track controlling efforts. He stopped runner who ran to fast gave them a jogging break and told them to start off on a slower pace if he thought it was needed. This was one aspect of his idea of tailoring the training to the needs of the individual. I do not have any great knowledge of training in US outside Oregon in the 70?s but I have the impression that this way of working the athletes was unique in the US at Bill's time.
He was as mentioned a believer in fartlek running. These are often described as easy runs. Bill was very aware and in many ways encouraged some of us to run some of these runs in a solid pace. These were runs between two sets of interval work in one session. Some of us we put in a major part of our training effort on these runs. This way he achieved some good work on running strength and some controlled racepace running in one session. By keeping the baserunning solid he made sure the athlete did not peak to early by putting to much into the faster stuff.
I have never heard Bill explain these aspects of his coaching in any detail and have never seen them described in books were Bill?s work is mentioned. They also makes Bowerman?s coaching hard copy or to categorize as Lydiard-based, interval-based or whatever.
I do however think they are essential to understanding the logic behind Bowerman?s programs.
KnutK
Thank you for your remarks. I thought that the fartlek workout in a way mirrored those workout days in which the runner would do intervals or a tempo workout, followed by a longish run, followed by sprints, and your comments confirm me in my judgment. Incidentally, one of my favorite track and field photos is one of you and Lindgren in T&FN running together (I think you are behind him) in a WSU-Oregon dual meet. My memory is that Lindgren ran 12:53 for three miles that day. Independent of that, you were always one of my favorite runners when I was growing up--so thanks.
I'd really love to read a good biography of Bowerman. If I remember right, a few years ago somebody on this board said Kenny Moore was working on a book about his former coach. Any truth to that? I hope so. Great subject+great writer=great book.
kenny moore has been living in eugene for quite a while now and is working hard on the book about his former coach and friend.
a couple of chapters have been posted on the RunningStats website.
What would be considered a fartlek?
To me, a fartlek has always been one of two things: Running w/ a couple of people and having each person take the lead on a run and run the pace they wanted (usually fast) for a bit, or running something like 5 minutes hard, 5 easy, 4 hard, 4 easy, and so on.
Knut,
Thanks for sharing your personal experience. Will you please describe the fartlek runs you used between intervals on the track? You said that you ran fartlek between sets of intervals, so what exactly did you do in the fartlek sessions? Tinman
Those fartlek runs varied.
A typical example of a Bowerman session i did was:
15 min jogg.
4*400 62->60 200 m jogg)
4 miles increasing pace finishing quite fast
6*100 m cut downs.
Or:
15 min jogg
400+600+400+200 1/2 distance jogg (61-59 pace)
5 miles vaied speed (usually I would put in 2 or 3 ca 1/2 miles hard
6*200 cut downs.
These are just acxamples.
KnutK
KnutK,
Do you have any insight on how much mileage Bowerman's runners typically did? I ask because we've all heard that he didn't really emphasize doing a lot of miles. I've read a quote where he said, "Why would you want to run a hundred miles a week? You'd get sore legs and wouldn't have time to study." I always heard that Prefontaine never did more than 70-80 mpw.
But I had a passing acquaintance with a guy who stayed with Prefontaine in his trailer for four days and did exactly the same training Prefontaine did in those four days. This guy said, "In those four days we ran 60 miles. Do you really think that after I left Prefontaine only did 10-20 miles over the next three days? What I think is that at Oregon they don't count their morning runs into their totals."
Any thoughts on this? Could the fact that Dellinger did most of the coaching with Prefontaine have had any impact?
Thanks in advance.
At the Univ. of Oregon (before Martin Smith arrived):
Most of the milers reportedly did 60-80 miles per week. Bob Williams, a steepler who ran 8:41.1 under Bowerman, ran 65-70 miles per week. I know that Pre was mostly trained by Bill Dellinger.
From personal experience as a 5km man who placed third in the 64 Olympics, Dellinger thought that more mileage was necessary to be good distance runner. He usually prescribed 80-90 per week for 5k-10k men with a long run of 15 miles at most. They ran consistent quality year-round unlike a lot of programs that separated training into mileage (off-season) and intensity training (in-seasn). So, if you think about it, a guy running 85 miles per week for the Ducks with two interval, fartlek plus a tempo run in the off-season was doing solid training all year. They may have not run 100 miles + per week in the off-season, but their quality was always there, but controlled quality.
A lot of people don't realize that Bill Dellinger, who is the real mastermind behind the distance runners success at Univ. of Oregon (Bowerman was the middle distance mastermind) included weekly 8-12 mile tempo runs for most of the year. Dellinger may not have called them tempo runs, but they sure were. The pace for his 29-30 minute 10k runners (4:40-4:50 per mile in races) for the solid 8-12 milers was 5-5:20 per mile, depending upon the distnce of the run. That is a perfect example of why Dellinger was producing such good 5k-10k runners. They trained their thresholds weekly in addition to building strength through hills, fartleks, and intervals that weren't hammered but run at a specified, controlled pace relative to ability level. Dellinger deserves a lot of credit for the success of the distance crews at Oregon. Bowerman deserves a lot of credit for the middle distance crews. Tinman