50+ Masters Training and Racing Open Forum

amkelley wrote:

All these shorter-distance race reports are giving me a hankering to try to get a little faster at the shorter distances...

I forget where you live but here, where we get some semblance of winter, it’s a perfect time to focus on speed. I’m planning to do that indoor meet in Wichita.

And speaking as a beginner, I have to say I’m surprised at the fine line between a half marathon pace and 5K. Supposedly it’s 30 seconds a mile but when I was in the groove on Saturday, as I say, it felt like my best tempo run. Just shorter! So jump in!!

And do your heel dips!!!

fisky wrote:

I'm not a distance runner, but I thought posters might enjoy this article about my training. The article does contain some misleading content. I do leg lifts, for example, but I avoid the complex movement lifts, like the clean and jerk, etc. My diet is also not as radical as the writer makes it seem. I eat normally during the times I'm not intermittently fasting.

Nice piece, fisky! I have noticed that the people profiles in this regular column in the WSJ never sound like they eat anything. I always go away shaking my head wondering how these people survive on so little food. Thanks for confirming my suspicion that there is some exaggeration involved.

Try being on the same team! Having raced Rick since college and Joe since 2008, they've always been the gold standard of consistent smart training & racing.

Spokane was much nicer than the last edition 10yrs ago. The course layout was done very well, and the footing was superb.

Random thoughts on Club Nats: 1) 40yr olds look really young now, they were flying and was fun to actually watch the race after 20yrs of being in the midst 2) Great post race party venue!, Ping pong, snacks and beer with the 40+ crowd getting 1st shot at the line! 3) Host sites really should have a good T-shirt logo, Kentucky, Penn, SF all were very good. 4) Hoka Aggies? Loved the kit but they'll always be ASIC to me.

5) This has turned into a great event. Ran my 1st in Orlando 1998 and it's a year-end highlight.

Running with my HS athletes today brought it back full circle, I saw athletes I raced back in the 70's when we thought the West Valley Track Club guys were ancient doing races as 30 year olds. Setting lofty goals, training hard and racing as best we can no matter when we started is a great thing and sets a great example and inspires me daily. My $.02.

Mike

KCgeezer wrote:

amkelley wrote:

All these shorter-distance race reports are giving me a hankering to try to get a little faster at the shorter distances...

I forget where you live but here, where we get some semblance of winter, it’s a perfect time to focus on speed. I’m planning to do that indoor meet in Wichita.

And speaking as a beginner, I have to say I’m surprised at the fine line between a half marathon pace and 5K. Supposedly it’s 30 seconds a mile but when I was in the groove on Saturday, as I say, it felt like my best tempo run. Just shorter! So jump in!!

I live in inland central California where the weather is pretty good for running outdoors year round. It doesn't snow, doesn't rain a whole lot, and our coldest nights are only slightly below freezing.

For me, a slower runner, my last 5K and my last half-marathon, both of which I considered good efforts, differed by 34 seconds per mile. That doesn't sound like so much, but it feels like a huge difference in effort. 5K pace feels like running almost as fast as I possibly can, while half-marathon pace feels easy for quite a while. The hardest thing I ever did in running was the one and only time I ran a road mile. I nearly passed out in the finishing chute. Give me a marathon any day...

Mike: you, Joe and Rick are made of iron as far as I can tell. Your team total was EIGHT points...ridiculous! #CNWgeezerdynasty

(PS I was getting lapped by Rick in track 10Ks when you were barely in high school, lol)

Nice race, you guys are really strong. Joe set a torrid pace, he went out as fast or faster than we did in Atlanta for the road 5K. After party at convention center was good, probably the best in the 4 or 5 Club XCs I've been to. See you at Lehigh if no sooner.

Thanks. If you set your goals low enough, you can achieve them and that’s what I did. Happy for my teammates to get 3rd, but sad that I didn’t contribute.

KCgeezer wrote:

And do your heel dips!!!

I do them all the time and I still have problems!!! Maybe that grade 2 Achilles tear I sustained back in 2011 celebrating my 50th B-day with some sprints at the track had something to do with it. ? I'll tell you what: Once you sustain a tendon or ligament tear (this makes three: Achilles, PTT & ACL) you are never the same!

Reading about racing gets me a bit hungry for it, too, but first I need to be back running fullstop once again. Right now my wife and I are run/walking our 3 or 4 miles daily, max'd at 4.5 so far. I am feeling less pain in my lower back (from all the sneezing and hacking from the sinus infection) but still a bit sore. Plus I am still bringing up some crud, though I can breath now and my head isn't going to explode. This has been one long recovery!

Got my first sub 12 minute pace for 4.5 miles two days back. Progress. and able to run the downhills a little bit, so the back is better, but endurance limited. All this caused me to lose a month in the gym, so lost about 3 pounds of muscle and am at my lightest weight in 20 or 30 years! Weird, and I still see that little bit of Iowa tummy fat on my mid, though it's less than an inch to pinch.

Stay healthy, folks, it's much more fun that way!

Injured Ivan wrote:

KCgeezer wrote:

And do your heel dips!!!

I do them all the time and I still have problems!!! Maybe that grade 2 Achilles tear I sustained back in 2011 celebrating my 50th B-day with some sprints at the track had something to do with it. ? I'll tell you what: Once you sustain a tendon or ligament tear (this makes three: Achilles, PTT & ACL) you are never the same!

I never suffered any obvious trauma to my Achilles. It just gradually got sore over the course of many hours following a hard 22-mile training run three and a half years ago and it never returned to normal, although I now have good weeks and bad weeks. I started doing heel drops a couple of months after the original injury, but after doing them religiously for several months and seeing no progress I quit. Only after I stopped doing the heel drops did the Achilles start to improve to the point where I could resume running, at least intermittently.

Checking in after arriving home from Spokane to wet slush, no electricity, trees down all over the place, and a pile of final exams to grade. Now the snow has melted, the power is back on, and my grades are in. Whew!

I headed to Spokane with the nasty chest cold that so many of us seem to have gotten. I didn't feel great but it didn't bother me when I was running at all. Still, I hadn't been sleeping well due to coughing and getting up at 3:00am to catch my flight didn't help me get more rest.

The course in Spokane had lots of turns but was basically running around soccer fields so was relatively flat and fast. I thought I could do well and was optimistic I could place 2nd or 3rd in my AG. Through 3 miles, I ran a good race with splits of 7:53, 8:00, and 8:03. I could hear people cheering for my competition who was just behind me for most of the race, but I had pulled away and was rounding the final bend to the straightaway to the finish line when I stopped in my tracks. I started to throw up and there was no way I could keep running. I lost almost a minute heaving over the edge of the course knowing that people were passing me. There was nothing I could do until it passed. After that "rest" I had my best kick ever to the line but finished a disappointing 4th ;-(

I've had bouts of retching before but it's usually after I cross the line. I didn't eat too soon before the race and my pace wasn't too fast to maintain. I did notice that my heart rate went from the 150s to the 180s right before I threw up and stayed high until I finished but I don't know if that's a Garmin issue or a physical problem. So I'm going to chalk this up to being sick and move on.

Despite the disappointing race, I had a great trip to Spokane. It was great to see so many masters running friends and to watch so many people sharing in the fun of racing XC. My team placed 2nd in the Grand Prix for the year and I raced in every one of the races so overall, it was a good year and it was nice to be recognized at the awards. On to Tallahassee in February!

Injured Ivan wrote:

I'll tell you what: Once you sustain a tendon or ligament tear (this makes three: Achilles, PTT & ACL) you are never the same!

I have heard this. I notice that our man Gary Patton above, he of the 15-mile training weeks, credits many factors for his success ... including good luck. Here's to good luck for us all going forward.

Congrats on Spokane Club Nats to all Harriers. I'm really bummed to have missed the whole party. I had my bags packed until pulling the plug Friday morning. The CRUD hit me so hard I couldn't even make the drive to watch. This plus hammy injury from 4 weeks before made that thing called reality real.

One of my oldest friends runs for Atlanta TC and has survived 2 heart surgeries recently. He toed the line and finished dead last. And was not at all embarrassed by that. He is a great example of Masters Runners & Friends For Life. I flew him to Portland for an overnight visit before he went home. That was as good as it gets.

KP

Get better. Cool story on your friend. I probably should have had the guts to battle him for that honor.

KP - We missed you in Spokane. Our friend was so exited to be out there running he was just glowing. He told me about coming to visit you and know how much that meant to him, especially after everything that he's been through. I told him about the forum and how I've "met" you guys. I think he may be posting in the future...

Sorry to hear about your misfortune near the finish SCgal. I've dealt with an upset stomach at some workouts and races, but usually it just slows me down but I can feel it coming on and I'll re-adjust the pace a little. It was a bitter pill to tie and lose the tie breaker to ATC 60+. Again. We're big rivals on the course, but good friends when the race is done. We enjoy the banter and trash talk. Our new nickname for your club is BRR-South. Like it?

MG, you've had some downtime, hope you can get back into a continuous training pattern. How many Club XCs have you been to now?

KP sorry you missed it this year, in your backyard practically, but good story on your friend. Hope he continues to improve.

CM - This was my 17th consecutive club xc nationals, tying me with a teammate. As far as I can tell, we hold the record for the longest current streaks. It was one of my worst finishes, by any measure, but I did finish without having to walk. Hopefully, I'll be in better shape next year (and in a new AG).

Nice race, btw! I was pretty focused on "orange", but did remember to cheer on your last lap.

MG - I think I heard you. Only heard my name called a couple times. W/ CNW they would cheer those guys as soon as I passed, as if they were right on my heels, not 8-10 seconds back. Effective psychological warfare! Dared not look back, however.

Stay healthy, rebuild, see you at your 18th!