• scotth
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/4/2011 10:30AM - in reply to dd
      • scotth
      • Per the last 2 posts, he'll never provide explanations and he'll never write a book. Don't hold your breath.
    • off course Oscar
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/4/2011 12:15PM - in reply to no bull son
      • off course Oscar
      • With all due respect, I am not going to repeat what I already said. Wait for it. We are living in a society where people are rewarded for things like this because people want to know about it...therefore a market....therefore money to be made...therefore....again, wait for it.
    • Junk Master
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/4/2011 12:22PM - in reply to off course Oscar
      • Junk Master
      • I don't buy the expose, book, race consultant gig motivation. Wise up folks, we are talking personality disorder here.
    • off course Oscar
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/4/2011 12:25PM - in reply to No Shit Sherlock
      • off course Oscar
      • No, you didn't have it figured out, not back in the beginning. You were assuredly one of the posters who couldn't figure out "how's he doing it".

        You want details? Speculation? Are you serious young man? A car or a bike or in some cases both...maybe with an accomplice who won't talk. It is as simple as that.

        Do you think he flew from 3 miles to 19 or 7 to 21?

        Go over the course before hand and find the best areas where you can get in and get out...not rocket science Mr. No Shit Sherlock. You are straining your brain far harder than need be. When he showed up in front of a pack of runners way behind him, and he was spotted at the start line, how do YOU think he did it.

        Personally I find it rather easy to explain and yes, there may have been some luck involved here and there, but he put the odds in his favor by picking spots where it wasn't likely to be seen. Traverse City...are you serious? Simple Simon.

        Now to Mr. No Shit Sherlock, does that help? Hearing it from his mouth shouldn't matter, you should easily be able to figure it out.

        p.s. He's not a master. He's a cheater. You've already put him on a pedestal.
    • off course Oscar
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/4/2011 12:34PM - in reply to Junk Master
      • off course Oscar
      • Back from a long run at Stoney Creek in beautiful weather, guessing what responses I will get...didn't surprise me.

        I don't buy it either, as in his original motivation, if that's what you are implying.

        I am saying that it is the end result regardless of his mental capacity.

        I also don't buy your personality disorder, I just think he likes people thinking he's faster and better than he is and enjoys talking about himself.

        I had psych and sociology in College...it's called egocentrism friend, possibly sprinkled with some sociopathic symptoms. Your guess might be as good as mine because we are basing it off of what we read, but I minored in both and it sounds like classic egocentrism to me.
    • Still No Shit Sherlock
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/4/2011 2:18PM - in reply to off course Oscar
      • Still No Shit Sherlock
      • off course Oscar wrote:
        No, you didn't have it figured out, not back in the beginning. You were assuredly one of the posters who couldn't figure out "how's he doing it".
        Are you serious? You think it was that tricky? Good grief.
    • forgive me for I have sinned
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 12:03AM - in reply to no bull son
      • forgive me for I have sinned
      • Take a look at this photo, which no-one has mentioned yet in the 92 pages of this thread:

        http://quod.lib.umich.edu/b/bh...m_dds_1988

        You can zoom in using the + button on the left. Everything is alphabetical.

        Here's the kicker - if any of you know any of the other individuals in the photo, it would be a potential bombshell to substantiate the March 16th comment at the bottom of this blog:

        http://www.writingaboutrunning...itton.html

        The same comment was made on the very first KL thread in mid 2010. I'm being a bit coy so that we don't run the risk of thread deletion...

        Do your work, detectives!
    • legalcurious
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 5:28AM - in reply to ouch1000
      • legalcurious
      • I'm a professor at a small college who deals with academic integrity violations four or five times each year. Students who are suspected of cheating have to prove their innocence beyond a reasonable doubt, not the other way around. I love the U. S. legal system, but in running and academics, the burden of proof is on the accused, not the accuser. I'm so fed up with our society's washed-out moral and ethical standards of behavior. If we all don't start holding ourselves to a higher standard, especially we runners, our future looks bleak indeed.

        There. I've said my piece.[/quote]

        "but in running and academics, the burden of proof is on the accused, not the accuser."

        So what you are saying is that if someone accuses a student for cheating, and even tho he didnt do it but just because he cant prove that he was guilty he will be punished? How ridiculous! This is not the way it should be. You are innocent until proven otherwise, not guilty until you can prove your innocence.
    • off course Oscar
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 6:04AM - in reply to Still No Shit Sherlock
      • off course Oscar
      • No, YOU did as you asked for details because you couldn't figure it out and wanted the "master" to tell you.

        Car or bike depending on the course or a possible cut through. You really think he flew from point to point, don't ya?

        Are YOU serious? Nice try on the reversal but you failed miserably!

        Good grief right back at ya as I think you need counseling, and fast.
    • Captain Tenneal
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 6:23AM - in reply to legalcurious
      • Captain Tenneal
      • legalcurious wrote:
        "but in running and academics, the burden of proof is on the accused, not the accuser."

        So what you are saying is that if someone accuses a student for cheating, and even tho he didnt do it but just because he cant prove that he was guilty he will be punished? How ridiculous! This is not the way it should be. You are innocent until proven otherwise, not guilty until you can prove your innocence.
        I agree for the most part, but Kip isn't just being randomly accused without evidence.
        There is 90+ pages detailing the evidence against him here. At this point, the burden of proof is on Kip.
    • legalcurious
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 6:30AM - in reply to Captain Tenneal
      • legalcurious
      • I agree for the most part, but Kip isn't just being randomly accused without evidence.
        There is 90+ pages detailing the evidence against him here. At this point, the burden of proof is on Kip.[/quote]

        Of course, I completely agree about Kip. This was merely a question to the idiot working at a college and treating students like this.
    • dukerdog
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 6:52AM - in reply to Captain Tenneal
      • dukerdog
      • Races should establish maximum chip time allowances. For anyone finishing under 3 hours in a marathon, their gun time will be adjusted a maximum of 30 seconds due to their chip times. Anyone from 3:00-3:10 a max. allowance of 45 seconds, etc. Obviously, this would need to be adjusted for large races.
        A rule like this would make it much more difficult and much more dangerous for people like Kippy to do their thing.
    • Junk Master
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 10:13AM - in reply to dukerdog
      • Junk Master
      • The disclosure he was kicked out of dental school for a semester for cheating, if true, sure makes the personality disorder diagnosis a lot stronger.

        I'd love to hear some responses from those "friends" of Kip who insist his pathological behavior is entirely running related.
    • Loofa Dog
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 10:28AM - in reply to dukerdog
      • Loofa Dog
      • dukerdog wrote:
        Races should establish maximum chip time allowances. For anyone finishing under 3 hours in a marathon, their gun time will be adjusted a maximum of 30 seconds due to their chip times. Anyone from 3:00-3:10 a max. allowance of 45 seconds, etc. Obviously, this would need to be adjusted for large races.
        A rule like this would make it much more difficult and much more dangerous for people like Kippy to do their thing.
        I don't know about that. You could be hurting some legitmate quality times at large marathons where someone from an open or further back corral runs a good legitmate time.

        Now looking at those chips for people who are earning age group or monetary awards, that I would support in a second.
    • dukerdog
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 12:04PM - in reply to Loofa Dog
      • dukerdog
      • Loofa Dog wrote:
        I don't know about that. You could be hurting some legitmate quality times at large marathons where someone from an open or further back corral runs a good legitmate time.

        Like I said, in larger races the max. chip adjustment might be different. But in a race with < 2500 there is no legitimate reason a 3-hr marathoner shouldn't get across the starting line in 30 seconds. He shouldn't be starting in the back of the back, and if he is it's his own fault.

        The big advantage of this is that it eliminates the need for an RD to disqualify someone. Kippy's most-used tactic simply won't work since he wouldn't get his 3-4 minute chip adjustment. Forcing him and his type to do all of their cheating at the front of the pack makes it much easier to catch them.
    • Still No Shit Sherlock
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 12:34PM - in reply to off course Oscar
      • Still No Shit Sherlock
      • off course Oscar wrote:
        No, YOU did as you asked for details because you couldn't figure it out and wanted the "master" to tell you.
        I think you'll find I didn't, I think you'll find that I said we can all speculate (meaning we could all make reasonable guesses at how he does it because its not hard) but we would not know exactly the minutae (although we could guess but I'm not interested in guessing).

        Its hard work having to explain stuff to this level of detail.

        With the "master" reference, I assumed that anyone reasonably intelligent would get the irony.
    • canada13
      • RE: Rojo says he might start a Kip Litton thread but only 1 and only 1 thread 10/5/2011 12:52PM - in reply to Still No Shit Sherlock
      • canada13
      • Or maybe it's just hard for you? There was no irony. The poster was right. Bike, vehicle or short course running in between. What can Kip explain to you that would satisfy your thirst for the obvious? As been said, he cheated.