Do weights interfering with running training?

I don't have an answer for you, but I had a similar situation. I'm 42 - about a year ago I started doing 20 pushups and 20 situps every hour, on the hour while I was at work. It immediately messed up my running - I felt unbalanced, tired and slow. I kept it up for about 8 weeks, then gave up.

Obviously, maybe if I had kept up with it I would have got better. But the point is that resistance training does change your body - if you have been running for a long time, the change might be hard to adjust to.

I'm in the same boat. One thing i figured out though is that if i neglect the weight training for too long, i will get hurt. So, i'm only doing 1 long run and 2 speed workouts per week and lifting the day after a long run and 2 days after the speed workout.

i limit it to 2 sets with weights heavy enough to do 12 reps. i also include front and side plank position holds.

i'm finding that this works and that i actually feel more stretched out and loose after lifting than before.

I just spotted my appalling grammar in the thread title - sorry! (bump)

I agree totally on injury prevention. I used to be a massage therapist and I am convinced that working a muscle carefully through the full range of motion, with enough weight to engage most fibres, is as effective as a massage in some cases. I do a lot of other exercises for core and for supporting muscles.

One more question: in my youth we did a Lydiard-like hill phase with hill reps twice per week for a month. I wasn't lifting at the time. Has anyone found their squats improve after hill training, or are they so different that there's no crossover? Any opinions on the merits of (a) two leg weights sessions, (b) one weights and one hills, or (c) two hill sessions?

If you lift at a gym, ask some of the big guys for the name of their connection, and buy some 'gear'.

You can thank me later!

Advice from an elder:

- adjust your schedule to four quality sessions on a two-week cycle. This allows for both quality and recovery. Make your recovery days just that- jog as slow as need be to minimize stress and maximize recovery.

-Periodize so that you are not overstressing any one factor excessively in a microcycle. For me, that means that I do heavier lifting in base phase, where the fast-twitch is getting nailed once a week in the gym, with some minor stress otherwise in the form of drills, plyos, strides and short hills. ALWAYS go by "feel"- if your legs aren't pretty fresh feeling after a proper warm up, don't push it.

-Later in the macrocycle, as things like tempos, long repeats, races, etc. are drawing from the fast-twitch "account", I back WAY off on the weight of the lifts, increase the reps somewhat, and mainly focus on recruitment and the deep stretching feeling that the lifts provide. For me, deep squats are key at this point in order to keep my glutes, hamstrings and quads fully pliant and strong. I am using less than half of the weight that I use in base (early macrocycle) phase. Often in the week, I will do unweighted squats or one-legged squats as part of my routine, just to keep the muscle memory fresh.

-Remember that weights, while a key factor in staying healthy,are but an adjunct to the overall training system.

maybe

been there run that wrote:

-Later in the macrocycle, as things like tempos, long repeats, races, etc. are drawing from the fast-twitch "account", I back WAY off on the weight of the lifts, increase the reps somewhat, and mainly focus on recruitment and the deep stretching feeling that the lifts provide.

This makes a lot of sense to me. So now that the quality of running needs to pick up, I'll just try to maintain and not to add more plates. No problem, gains were pretty good for the first few months and I can pick up again at end of season.

I've been a big fan of sub-maximal weights for stretching and recovery for years. Strangely I never see that talked about much...

Thanks!

weakling wrote:

I agree totally on injury prevention. I used to be a massage therapist and I am convinced that working a muscle carefully through the full range of motion, with enough weight to engage most fibres, is as effective as a massage in some cases. I do a lot of other exercises for core and for supporting muscles.

One more question: in my youth we did a Lydiard-like hill phase with hill reps twice per week for a month. I wasn't lifting at the time. Has anyone found their squats improve after hill training, or are they so different that there's no crossover? Any opinions on the merits of (a) two leg weights sessions, (b) one weights and one hills, or (c) two hill sessions?

squats seem to have little to no impact on hill running, and even more true for the vica versa.

Consolidate your training stresses. That is really the best way to go about it. Lift on your hard running days as a secondary workout in the PM. If you don't then you'll always be a little sore for your running workouts.

I'd eliminate the cleans as they are too technique oriented. If you want an explosive exercise try speed squats or jump squats. With speed squats just drop the load you would normally do and do 5-10 very fast reps. You'll probably need to drop down to about 30% of 1rm. For jump squats I would stick with just the bar.

Cut back on total volume. How many exercises are you doing? More than 4-6 and it's overkill for your goals. Stick to 1-2 days per week. Once a week if doing a lot of hard running workouts as well, twice a week during "base building".

I'd keep the squat simply because it is the "king" as a strength builder and you won't get a similar hormone response with any other exercise save for maybe the deadlift. Then, transition to bilateral movements such as the split squat when you do hard running workouts.

Here's a simple example:

12 weeks Base Building:

1. Lift twice a week.

2. 4-6 exercises total body (squats, rdls, bench, db row, shoulder press, chin up)

3. 1-2 easy warm-up sets, one "go" set at 4-6 reps. Example Squat: 95x5, 125x5, 185x5

6 weeks early season:

1. Lift once a week

2. 4-6 exercises total body transition into bilateral movements (split squat, db single leg rdl, db bench, standing cable alternating row, db alternating shoulder press, cable alternating lat pulldown)

3. 1-2 easy warm-ups, one "go" set at 4-6 reps.

6 weeks late season:

1. Lift once a week, include plyos or speed lifts (speed squat OR jump squat OR Split Box Jump

2. follow same as above. For speed movements or plyos stick to 2-3 sets of 5 reps. Reduce to 4 exercises instead of 6.

Anyway, that's one way to do it.

Alan

Runningart2004 wrote:

Consolidate your training stresses. That is really the best way to go about it. Lift on your hard running days as a secondary workout in the PM. If you don't then you'll always be a little sore for your running workouts.

Alan, I've seen you give this advice before but it's just not realistic. Workout days are the longest days (time-wise) of the week because of the warmup, cooldown, stretching, strides, etc. Plus you may have to drive over to the track rather than just stepping out your door for a run.

Most people here are doing their workouts in the evening after work. Now you're suggesting we drive over to the gym after the workout as well? Not gonna happen, if that's the plan I guarantee a lot of gym days are going to get skipped.

What advice can you give that's realistic?

^^^^^^ WTF? Lifting once or 2x a week is not realistic? Buy some weights for your garage you lazy deadbeat.

No, you misunderstood. I'm saying lifting weights on the same day you do your hard workouts is not realistic, at least for those of us working full time. If you're a student or have a more lax schedule, go for it.

Periodizing you weight training might be something you should consider instead of just lifting the same every time all year. Here's an example for a 20 week season.

4 Weeks- Base lifting

4 Weeks- Maximal Strength (in the form of muscular endurance)

4 Weeks- Power

4 Weeks- Conversion to Muscular endurance

6 Weeks- Taper

The worst thing you can do is try and kill it in the weight room. The weight room is designed to be supplemental and the only way to get better at running is to run more. I suggest keeping lifts limited to 1 squat exercise, 1 pull exercise, and 1 push exercise. If you can do Olympic lifts properly then you can also add that but only if you are well trained in them.

Also, keep the lifting sessions functional. Meaning the lifts should be training something similar to running. I will disagree with RunningArt on bench press as I think it is the most useless exercise in the weight room unless you are trying to gain size, despite how powerful it will make you (the power will translate to the upper body, when most upper body work is used from momentum anyway during running).

In your 40s your testosterone levels are dropping, which will slow your recovery from weight lifting. I don't have an answer for that (other than "gear", like the other guy said)

I'm lifting twice per week but i'm not doing a bunch of speed right now. I find that if i don't kill it in the weight room, i can feel more recovered after lifting. right now the schdule is:

sun - long run

mon - am run/ pm lift

tues - am run/ pm run (am short speed workout)

wed - run (med long)

thurs - am run/pm pm

fri - off

sat - tempo

this gives me 2 days between lifting and no speed workout directly after a lifting day.

i'm more aggressive with the upper body weights but my goal for any leg lifting is getting the full range of motion and be able to do 12-15 reps. lower body is 1)split leg squats with smith bar 2)leg press 3) calf raises 4) adductors 5)abductors 6) one-legged straight leg quad extension 7) ball curls for the hams.

i'm not getting thrashed on this routine. if i start to, i'll drop the number of sets to 1.

save the hardcore lifting for the off season.

Running interferes with weights.

Then lift only during the off-season and do bodyweight exercises in-season when you're running hard.

The problem with alternating lifting and running is that you end up with this mess:

Monday: Lift and run easy

Tuesday: Track work..sore from yesterday

Wednesday: run

Thursday: Lift and run easy

Friday: tempo...sore from yesterday.

Saturday: run

Sunday: Long run

Too much day after day stress. You can't think of lifting and running as complete opposites as they each will effect each other. That is why most runners don't lift. Lack of time/motivation to get to the gym. If you want to lift, then lift. If you don't have the time, then don't.

If you want to do my second option and lift off-season then bodyweight exercises in-season or while doing hard workouts then do this instead:

Explosive Pushups: 10-15. 2-3 sets. (Med ball traveling pushups if you have a med ball)

Pullups or inverted row: amrap, depends on if you have anything to hang from or under

Leg Crank: Just one: 24 squats, 24 split squats, 24 split jumps, 24 jump squats.

Done. Repeat 1-2 times week on your workout days in the evening.

Alan

tubbs wrote:

I'm lifting twice per week but i'm not doing a bunch of speed right now. I find that if i don't kill it in the weight room, i can feel more recovered after lifting. right now the schdule is:

sun - long run

mon - am run/ pm lift

tues - am run/ pm run (am short speed workout)

wed - run (med long)

thurs - am run/pm pm

fri - off

sat - tempo

this gives me 2 days between lifting and no speed workout directly after a lifting day.

Can you clarify? You have lift once on that schedule and it sure looks like you have a speed workout on Tuesday, the day directly after you lift on Monday.