Did Cal Poly Get Screwed????

Poly wanna cracker?

I'm confused. Are you asking if they screwed themselves by not placing in the top two? Are you asking if they screwed themselves by not earning an at-large by beating the right teams? How exactly are you suggesting they screwed themselves?

I guess I am asking whether people think the at large system or the tie breaker in college is flawed, and thus if they think Cal Poly should be going to Nationals. Sorry for any confusion. I don't think Poly screwed themselves, they ran a good race.

as I talked w/ a guy on the team the who tried to explain the system to me, i couldn't help but wonder if this would happen....again. It's so frustrating b/c it seems like mark peaks them perfectly for a top 12-15 run at nat's yet this is (IIRC) at least the third time this has happened to Poly.....everybody knows they would be what, 20th at worst?? yet they sit home...

I know i'm totally biased but it just seems like the situation would, at least hopefully, be rectified with at least 2, if not 3, discretionary at large team bids. its just silly to punish Mr C and the boys for peaking at the right time and showing up when it counts....rather than lighting the world on fire in september...shame.

dude-

scoring the top five against one another seems arbitrary, almost like rescoring in a new way which undermines normal scoring. 6th man takes depth into account but may not be totally fair either.

I think the current system is about as good as it can be except for the fact that it does not take into account teams that perform well late in the season when it counts. Especially, for teams not in the very top tier they can race great and in this case tie a top 15 ranked team but get left at home. I'm willing to bet Cal Poly would have beat a fair amount of teams going to Nationals which say they should be there.

Another question, if there was a tie during say pre-nationals would it count as a point or go to a tie breaker as well?

I's say they did get screwed, but thats the way it goes. I'm not sure if there should be picks that are based on late season performance or not. Either way it will never happen because it only affect smaller teams and rarely occurs. Until it happens to Oregon nothing will change.

an off topic question- what happens if the 2nd and 3rd place teams tie? Do both auto?

Poly is a good team and would probably place higher at nationals than some of the teams that are going but they knew the system the same as every other team. As a team that underachieved through most of the season, they knew they had to beat one of those 5 teams and unfortunately for them they came up 1 point short. I saw a UCLA guy fall in the mud 100m from the finish right in front of a Poly guy. If that hadn't happened ASU would have beaten Poly outright anyway.

As a side note, Poly is also the reason we have the blocker rule in the first place. A few years back they finished 3rd (or maybe 4th) in the region without any points and kept out Oregon who finished right behind them. This was the second time this happened with Cal Poly peaking well at regionals and blocking other teams so they added the blocker rule. I wouldn't be surprised to see a change to the current blocker rule to include a team that ties an advancing team at regionals, but not until that situation arises with an NCAA darling (Oregon, Stanford, Wisconsin, Arkansas). Unfortunately, rules are re-written to help the Cal Poly's of the world.

Cal Poly isn't in the BCS, so all things being equal, they're out...

Wait a minute, this isn't football...sorry about that.

Oh well, they're out anyway.

I totally agree. They know the system which means that they weren't ready when it counted. They had to either beat teams earlier in the year or beat ASU on saturday. They did neither, therefore they don't go. Unfortunate for them, but also their fault. Next year poly, make it happen for yourselves.

if you want to blame something blame the tie breaking rule. Looking over the results, Poly had their 7th man in before ASU's 5th and still lost in the tie breaker

well son.... wrote:

if you want to blame something blame the tie breaking rule. Looking over the results, Poly had their 7th man in before ASU's 5th and still lost in the tie breaker

Agreed.

When, exactly, did the 6th and 7th men become irrelevant in college xc. OK, they're not completely irrelevant... But at every other level of the sport in the US, the 6th man is the tie breaker. This 1-5 tie breaker is terrible. They've already scored the top 5. Now they're going to score them again? XC is a TEAM sport. Not just the 5, but all 7 should count. Yes, I know 6 and 7 displace runners from other teams driving up those teams' scores, but it doesn't seem right the way they have these ties and tiebreakers set up.

mighty porn stache wrote:

Yes, I know 6 and 7 displace runners from other teams driving up those teams' scores

In this regard, 6 and 7 runners are far more important than you're acknowledging. 6 and 7 runners displace other team's athletes in almost every XC race run, but this tiebreaking procedure applies only to the regional meet, and only to situations like this, where advancement to the national meet is at stake.

Perhaps they should have an NIT tournament for the also-rans, like they do in basketball.

Cal Poly did know the system, but a system that forces you to peak for pre-nats doesn't seem quite right. You should not have to hold a peak for that long. Knowing the rules doesn't make it suck any less for a team that ran their heart out a regionals, which is the most important race of the year (Or at least should be) minus nationals.

Maybe we just need to redraw regions because they are incredibley unfair, when is the last time the west didn't get the most teams in. Cal poly would be an auto in several other regions.

Having seen the West get in as many as NINE teams just a few years ago, i was surprised to see "only" 5 teams go from that region. Of course, I thought Wazzu was much stronger and would finish top 5-6. Oh well. On to nationals, which will be fun to watch anyway.

Yes, in my opinion Cal Poly should be allowed to run at the NCAA meet.

Unfortunately I'm not on the commitee that writes the rules, we just enforce them. Tough Break for them.