high school runners not ruuning enough!

I kinda have to agree as long as the athlete can do it without injuring them selves. Ritz did the same thing and Gerry Lindgren was known for doing 300 mile weeks. It is also well documented that Pre did most everything with his hearrate up around 180. I understand running slower when training for a Marathon, but not many high schoolers are.

300 miles a week, is that documented anywhere? i know we can all divide but thats like 43 miles a day, that would be pretty amazing

I agree and disagree. In my opinion I see that there are only a few runners who excelled with those kinds of workouts (high intensity, high mileage). The reason I see for that is there are not many people who have the mentality to excell with that kind of training. Esp. now a days with so many other distractions so easily available. I do agree that if a person has the mentality that they want to be the absolute best, and then the mentality that they will settle for nothing less than number one, then the training will work. If they don't have that mentality then it doesn't matter what kind of training one does, it just won't be worth it.

At the very least, it is not too much to ask one hour a day of running for high schoolers. All other sports routinely practice twice this long. 8-8.5 miles in one hour equals 55-60 miles per week. If runners are able to handle more as they grow stronger, it will only help them.

How many miles a week do you think a high schooler should be running in the US?

1. If Eliud is 18, then I am 9.

2. You seriously think Magness is the only high mileage runner in the US high school system? You know nothing! Half of the guys that run 9:00 are running 80+ miles per week with plenty of insane workouts. Ritz, Solinsky, Hall, TONS of guys ran huge miles and huge workouts, and they became great.

3. Most people on here criticize high intensity low volume programs, not high intensity high volume programs. There are very few of the latter in America. I am from a not so good running state, and there are only one or two schools in my entire state that have their male runners runnning consistently over 30 miles per week (I kid you not).

I agree and disagree. In my opinion I see that there are only a few runners who excelled with those kinds of workouts (high intensity, high mileage). The reason I see for that is there are not many people who have the mentality to excell with that kind of training. Esp. now a days with so many other distractions so easily available. I do agree that if a person has the mentality that they want to be the absolute best, and then the mentality that they will settle for nothing less than number one, then the training will work. If they don't have that mentality then it doesn't matter what kind of training one does, it just won't be worth it. >>

Amen; this is "the problem" in a nutshell.

Some of you need to coach at the HS level and see if you can use your infinite wisdom to motivate young people these days to dedicate themselves totally to running when there are so many more things for them to do. Those of us that are on the front lines doing so understand the difficulty of this task.

Our job is not to train future elite distance runners; our job is to provide young people with the best experience in the sport of distance running possible in the short time we work with them. A part of that responsibility is to encourage those who have the "mentality" to do more. But many if not most of us are finding it more difficult every year to find young people who are single-minded enough to do so, and even if we do, there is a huge attrition rate among those who did little else but run in HS and then reflect what other options are available to them the first time things go wrong in college or beyond.

I am not about to give up. I've seen running become a positive force in too many young lives to quit because not enough of my runners make the sport the center of their lives. But unless you're among young people encouraging them in their quest for excellence, you have three choices: Lead, follow, or get out of the way. Don't just sit on the sidelines and throw stones.

I'd have to agree on high mileage in high school if you are able to do it without much injury. If you're able to do it don't worry about the pace or anything. Just get in the miles. If want to take some easy days just do it. I'm sure Lingren ran many of his miles easy. About Lingren's miles i've heard different things, like his long run being as long as 88 miles. He'd start in the morning running to Mt. Spokane(44 miles from his home), take a break, and then run back. Regardless of wiether his mileage is true or not he still put in a ton and ran some seriously crazy times even for now. Too much of the problem of runners not getting in the high mileage is being afraid of burning out and worrying about the future. That's good to think about for yourself. But for Ryun, Lingren, Hulst and many others they just thought about being good then, not later.

You bring up some good points usher. Our local coach says the same thing. This is expecially true at the smaller schools. If the attrition rate is too high, you are left with too few runners for a complete team.

As I said before, an hour a day is not too much to ask of runners when other sports practice 2 hours a day. If this becomes the expected norm, it is easier to be accepted.

"homo", i dont kow what else to call you, but i absolutly agree with your assertation about plenty of high schoolers that run 80+ miles a week and get results, i used steve because up until march of his senior year he was just another sub 4:20 in the crowd of many, he said it himself because of his astronomical base he was able to shave 16 seconds off his MILE TIME, thats insane. if you can give me documents that show any other highschooler that had been running sub 4:20 already, which is awesome, and then took 16 or more seconds off in a year, then i would be impressed with that person too, but i know of none other than magness. also if you can show be proof of more than a handful of highschoolers running 100+ miles a week i would also be impressed, theres a big difference between 80 and 100.

- "DAAAA HIIIILLLLL"

m Ryun's famous 40x440 workout, which resulted in a PB of 3:51

That is folklore bullshit.

What is a "Deusch" bag? My German is a little rusty.

lingren also ran all of his pr's before the age of 22...what does that say about his high intensity/high volume training???

Yes, he was able to run at a very elite level, however he failed to consistently improve year after year. He should have been running his best times in his late 20's. I have a feeling that his high intensity and high mileage at such a young age hindered his ability to consistently develop over his career.

I am now 22 and currently run upwards of 110 miles per week. However, as a high school runner I never ran more than 35miles per week, and I think it was the best thing I ever could have done (credit there goes to my HS coach!). I have consistently improved substantially every year for the last 6 years while gradually increasing mileage and intensity. I think thats how it should be done. Most HS kids' bodies have not developed to the point where they can withstand high mileage training. For those whose bodies are ready (ala Solinsky), its fine to train that hard, but for the majority of high school kids its just going to lead to injuries, burnout, and un-acomplished goals. Of all the kids I ran with in college the ones who had trained higher mileage in high school did not improve and became frustrated, while the lower mileage guys were able to consistently improve year to year, and overall had significantly more success. Just my 2 cents....

scott d wrote:

the only person i see doing this to the extreme is steve magness. going from A junior year 4:17 mile to a senior year 4:01 all because of his 100+ mile weeks. we need to see more of that.

i do 90-100 mile weeks in the summer and 70-80 over winter. you just dont know about me, i only run a 16:20 5k. im sure there are plenty of others in the same boat as me. i also bet there are tons of kids way faster than me who run about half as much as i do. it's all about trying to make it there one day, even if it may be impossible, you have to believe that you can run 4:01, or 8:40. lots of kids are out there really going for it.

burnout wrote:

Of all the kids I ran with in college the ones who had trained higher mileage in high school did not improve and became frustrated, while the lower mileage guys were able to consistently improve year to year, and overall had significantly more success. Just my 2 cents....

Let's hear it, who are these "higher mileage" guys who didn't imporove? What was their mileage?

burnout wrote:

Most HS kids' bodies have not developed to the point where they can withstand high mileage training. For those whose bodies are ready (ala Solinsky), its fine to train that hard, but for the majority of high school kids its just going to lead to injuries, burnout, and un-acomplished goals. Of all the kids I ran with in college the ones who had trained higher mileage in high school did not improve and became frustrated, while the lower mileage guys were able to consistently improve year to year, and overall had significantly more success. Just my 2 cents....

I think that's a bunch of shit. If an 8 year old in African can run 70 mpw barefoot, an American high schooler can, too. I am one of the more unathletic persons I know and I was able to consistently train in the 80 mpw range in my fourth year of training.

Read some of these Renato posts. His Kenyans ran a lot before coming to him, and most of it was at a low intensity. Kids can handle the volume, but not the intensity. I left HS with 8,000+ miles and ran no more than 12% of my mileage at any kind of quality and had improved over 4 minutes on my 5k in 2 years.

Start wherever you can start. I started at 25 mpw weeks and made a bump every summer and every winter.

Ideally, our kid shold be leaving be leaig HS with 10,000+ miles.

2 hours a day? alright. You are taking the very very rough figures here.

Are the "other sports" in a constant state of working their ass off in their practices? no. There are rests, along with lectures and water breaks.

As for the runners.... 60 minutes running. PLUS about 30 minutes of stretching. PLUS and ab/pushup stuff they do.

Runners work a whole lot harder than most High School sports. However, i do agree with you for the most part, a lot of people need to be working a lot harder. But not necessarily at the top end.

guest wrote:

As for the runners.... 60 minutes running. PLUS about 30 minutes of stretching. PLUS and ab/pushup stuff they do.

Are we stretching our way to the top?

Richard Neer wrote:

Are we stretching our way to the top?

I agree. Did you ever see a lion stretch before it kills lunch?