Is this Tom Fleming? If so, you were a great, tough runner. I saw you win that pro marathon in LA from Hollywood to the Pacific Ocean, via Sunset Blvd. My friend Tony Brien, (rip), ran it too.
Is this Tom Fleming? If so, you were a great, tough runner. I saw you win that pro marathon in LA from Hollywood to the Pacific Ocean, via Sunset Blvd. My friend Tony Brien, (rip), ran it too.
jscott wrote:
Is this Tom Fleming? If so, you were a great, tough runner. I saw you win that pro marathon in LA from Hollywood to the Pacific Ocean, via Sunset Blvd. My friend Tony Brien, (rip), ran it too.
The Tony Brien who was from Ireland and ran at some small school in Kansas? Regardless, sorry to hear your friend died.
roger wrote:
[quote]HRE wrote:
My best racing came in the years when I'd do 130-150 during the summer. I paid no attention to pace. If I felt good I'd run fast, if not I'd run slow. The heat and humidity usually kept the intensity failry low. Come autumn, with shorter
DUDE, i admaire all the work you did and the way you did it but what kind of times did you run?
Thanks. But it never amounted to much. I'll preface this by saying that I never ran any distance at faster than 6:00 pace in high school. I manged stuff like 15:34/5km, 32:20/10km, 54:48/10 mile, 2:35:21 marathon. I enjoyed it.
I've been away from this thread for a while and maybe you're not reading anymore, but if you are I'd just like to tell you thatw as one hell of a message and that having done that kind of volume, I have no doubt that you're being honest. Only someone who has done this sort of thing can really describe what it's like as accurately as you've done.
Cheers!
amen
yes, Tony Brien, Marymount College, Salina, Ks, by way of Dublin, Ireland. He died about 10 years ago of ALS...a horrible way to go; and even more so for a once great runner. We both ran briefly for Club Midwest after college.
Sad to hear. He was, as I recall, a pretty big volume guy. RIP.
yes...Tony was definitely a high mileage guy, running 120 to 150 mpw, alot of weeks.
thanks for sharing. It was better than most books!
stay off concrete as much as possible. Asphalt has much more 'give' to it. And, of course, grass, dirt, trails, etc....anything you can find in your area. I used to run on the concrete sidewalks (for saftey), (straight out Mission Rd. to 112th and back to Fairway, in KC-12 miles) but they are much harder on the legs. Just mix it up as much as possible. In Santa Monica, I could run 10 miles on golf course type grass in Palisades Park. Big difference! But, you have to do some running on the roads if you are going to race on the roads.
heathyrunner wrote:
thanks for sharing. It was better than most books!
Oh Jesus. No it wasn't. It was poorly written, poorly faked, and poorly finished.
Wow, some guy comes on here and tells the "Romantic" tale of his 'Loneliness of the Long Distance Runner'-styled transformation from Ugly jogging duckling to beautiful, super-fast swan, and you all eat it up to pieces. For the love of God. If he was real, he would tell us who he was.......PERIOD. Why would he hide??? No good reason. Anyone who improved that much and KEEPS improving (sounds like he is well below 14:00 now, according to this last post), wouldn't mind sharing his name. He'd have nothing to lose really.
But hey, if such a spun tale as that makes you happy, makes you believe, then so be it. But remember: HRE and Tom Fleming ran the same mileage, and one ran 2:12 and one ran 2:35. High Mileage isn't magic. It's not even that useful for many runners.
And as much as I am INCREDIBLY impressed with Tom Fleming's ability, his training teaches me nothing. Running 140 miles a week at 5:40 pace?!?!? Holy crap. Besides showing desire, which it of course does shwo, it mainly shows awesome, awesome durability and talent (yes, most people certainly do NOT have the ability to withstand/absorb such super-high loads of training and flourish. ) It would be like Michael Jordan showing me how he practiced for basketball. It ain't gonna help me much.
Good luck to all, and believe in fantasies if they make you faster.
you are right that 140 mpw will not turn "average joe" into a national class runner like a Tom Fleming. We each bring 'natural, God-given ability' to the table. Hard work, a tough minded attitude all help to 'get better', but to think that 'anyone' running what TF did, will have them racing like TF did, is 'crazy'. Just like me doing hard, vertical jump drills, with a 'naturally good' jumper, will not get me anywhere near his high jump. btw, TF's training pace was brutally fast, even by 'national class' standards. Not for many. Ron Tabb trained 'fast' like that; but it is extremely difficult to do, mentally, even if you could, physically.
Mee Yung Ho wrote:
Good luck to all, and believe in fantasies if they make you faster.
I'm guessing the main reason you are not a runner anyone has heard or gives a shit about is more a function of your attitude than your ability.
A 10:00 HS two-miler to a 5th at Boston because he started doing higher mileage. Another poster here, malmo, has stated numerous times that he didn't have any "talent" until he started logging the 140 mile weeks. Problem is, most of us never know if we'll be any good because few of us ever put in the work to see if the genetic potential is there. The myth is that you will know with low mileage if you have the potential to be world class. The fact is that you won't know until you've done the training.
With your attitude, it's clear you'll never find out. Not that any of us care, however, because you're really an ass.
clear, concise, and accurate
thanks
Hey fella, you should really consider shutting the f*** up about people who you don't know. I happen to know HRE a little, so let me tell you a little bit about why you're a dumbass, OK?
It sounded like you were dissing on HRE for not running super fast in comparison to Fleming. I think HRE's 800m PR is like 2:20, and I am pretty sure he didn't break 5min in the 1600m. His walked on collegiately and his times there were rather unremarkable (putting it mildly). His first marathon was in the upper 4hr range and while he was always runner, I think it was sometime after that when he wanted to see what he could do. Isn't that what we all want to see? To see how much we squeeze out of the talent we were alloted? So, then HRE did the work just like any of the big names you know and it got him a 15:30ish 5K and a 2:35 marathon. I coach some people and am fairly active in my running community and whenever anyone asks about potential, I pull out HRE story because there is none better at showing that even someone with very meager talent (overstatement) can go a long way with good work (so many people feel like a Boston qualifying time is like THE benchmark of most people's ultimate potential).
So, HRE is one of my running heroes. If you want to see what you can do, you'd better like running and you'd better really want to because no one is going to beg you to do it. In this way, HRE is the epitome of someone who purely was intrinsically motivated AND had the discipline to execute good training to see how far he could go... just about everyone could take a few notes from him. Kinda sucks the way things seem to work out unfairly sometimes - if he could've taken his love/dedication to the sport, but had YOUR talent, then he absolutely would've been a beast (nothing against Fleming, 2:12 is awesome, but HRE with your talent probably would've left Fleming in the dust). Just doesn't seem right. Actually, truth be told, though... if he HAD to choose one or the other, I'd say he got the better of the deal (and you probably got the worse).
Sorry to go off on this rant, but it bugs the hell out of me when people disrespect others who put in the work.
In defense of Mee Yung Ho, it doesn't seem to me that he intended to disrespect HRE. The idea of the post is that 140 mpw doesn't automatically get you to a certain level. There are other factors that determine how fast you can run besides your motivation to work hard, and I don't think anyone on the board will dispute that.
Now that I know about him, HRE is a hero to me as well.
Bum wrote:
Another poster here, malmo, has stated numerous times that he didn't have any "talent" until he started logging the 140 mile weeks.
I've never said that.
jscott wrote: Ron Tabb trained 'fast' like that; but it is extremely difficult to do, mentally, even if you could, physically.
Obviously the Ron Tabb that you're talking about isn't the same 2:09 marathoner Ron Tabb that most here have heard of?
malmo wrote:
Bum wrote:Another poster here, malmo, has stated numerous times that he didn't have any "talent" until he started logging the 140 mile weeks.
I've never said that.
Sorry malmo, that was Hodgie-san that said "Ya know, the more I ran, the more "talented" I became". You simply agreed that it was a fairly accurate way of putting things if I remember correctly. My bad.
Bum wrote:
Sorry malmo, that was Hodgie-san that said "Ya know, the more I ran, the more "talented" I became". You simply agreed that it was a fairly accurate way of putting things if I remember correctly. My bad.
No, that's what I have said, which is not the same as what you said that I said. Which isn't to say that Hodgie-san couldn't have come up with the same aphorism independently. Nothing is original.