Time for an Honest Assessment of Ritz's Performance

Sarge, I think that was his point.

"A steady performer who will stand out nationally and have no impact internationally"

The implication was that there is something wrong with becoming a "careerist runner." Ritz has no choice and neither did Culpepper. When Ritz breaks 13:00 (he won't), 27:00 (he won't), and 2:07 (he might), then being a player internationally perhaps becomes part of the conversation.

So running 2:32 is evidence that you're not world class? Is it evidence that Dire Tune also is not world class? I mean, Tune ran that laggard pace and then collapsed. Is she just not good enough yet?

3rd in two major marathons, your only marathons at all on top of that with one of them being 2:25, is VERY good.

Yes, she could benefit from less flag waiving, but doing this well in one's first two marathons is a good thing. That she hasn't matched the potential she and others feel she has only makes her hungrier (we hope).

Below is an excerpt from a previous interview about DR called "The Making of a Marathoner" conducted by RW. Scroll down to the piece where he specifically talks about why he transitioned from the shorter distances to the marathon. I like his premise, but think he should have spent more time developing his speed-endurance (not simply speed) before tackling the marathon. Hopefully, he'll revisit, build those metabolic systems, and give the thon a try later on.

See attached:

http://www.runnersworld.com/article/0,7120,s6-243-297--11600-0,00.html

You're missing the point. You said that Ritz is a comparatively better runner than Kara. That is absolutely incorrect. How on earth could you possibly come to that conclusion?[/quote]

You are assuming that Women's distance running is as competitive as Men's; which it is not. She is competing against a softer field, that is why you conclude that Goucher is a better runner than Ritz. I do not believe her times are as impressive as his.

For multiple reasons, I am a Ritz fan. I also support guys like Hall, Webb, Baughs,and all the other guys out there working their butts off to see just how far they can go in the sport of running.

Let me ask a question: How many times did Tergat run the marathon before he worked out the kinks and ran a world best? Several, as I recall. Why can't we give Ritz more time to develop before saying he can't cut it at the world level in marathon racing? Heck 2:10:00 is an excellent time, and considering he ran too fast the first third of the race I'd say he probably had another 30-60 seconds in him that day.

Let's cut the guy some slack. It isn't easy being an elite runner, and racing a marathon successfully is never an easy task. Scenarios: You miss a water station and you become slower. You drink too much and you get a gut-ache and have to run through 20 minutes of discomfort before feeling decent again. Many potential hazards exist, which can corrupt a good race-plan.

Oh there they go. There they go, every time I start talkin 'bout running, a white man got to pull Rocky Marciano out their ass. That's their one, that's their one. Rocky Marciano. Rocky Marciano. Let me tell you something once and for all. Rocky Marciano was good, but compared to Joe Louis, Rocky Marciano ain't shit.

Tinman,

The problem with this site is the majority of the posters are not elite runners, have no concept of what it takes to run at the elite level in the marathon let alone the 2:19:00 2012 standard..its sad but its true..a 2:10:00 marathon is an outstanding time. I was rooting for Ritz too but Meb even more cause they barely mentioned him on letsrun and all the hype was on Ritz..the problem lies in the fact that the big names seem to be the only runners the media likes to give attention to..they forget the 99.9% of the disciplined athletes who are training. Meb running 2:09:21 should have been given more press time.

There is a good chance that Ritz is just a past great high school runner who will never reach the absolute top.

He is already a step ahead of most of the other national HS champions from past years. Maybe he used up most of his miles and development in HS? It does happen.

It almost seems like he has "old" legs. His races give the impression of say a 36 year old Bill Rodgers.

Let me just say I know Bill Rodgers. Bill Rodgers is a friend of mine. And, Mr. Ritzenhein, you are no Bill Rodgers (or even a 36 year old Bill Rodgers.)

What the hell do you mean by old legs? That's idiotic.

SMJO wrote:

There is a good chance that Ritz is just a past great high school runner who will never reach the absolute top.

He is already a step ahead of most of the other national HS champions from past years. Maybe he used up most of his miles and development in HS? It does happen.

It almost seems like he has "old" legs. His races give the impression of say a 36 year old Bill Rodgers.

Honestly, Ritz is very, very good for a white guy.

Tinman wrote:

Let me ask a question: How many times did Tergat run the marathon before he worked out the kinks and ran a world best? Several, as I recall. Why can't we give Ritz more time to develop before saying he can't cut it at the world level in marathon racing? Heck 2:10:00 is an excellent time, and considering he ran too fast the first third of the race I'd say he probably had another 30-60 seconds in him that day.

Tergat ran 2:05 in his second marathon and he broke the WR on his third. Khannouchi also set the WR on his third, Geb on his 5th. The marathon is not easy on the body and one does not get that many high quality attempts.

2:10 was a great time when Malmo was running. The discussion here is an indication of the extent to which the Africans have raised the bar.

[quote]Coach D wrote:

Tergat ran 2:05 in his second marathon and he broke the WR on his third. Khannouchi also set the WR on his third, Geb on his 5th. The marathon is not easy on the body and one does not get that many high quality attempts.

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I am fairly sure Tergat did not run his wrold record until his 4th, not 2nd, marathon. He was second in the 2001 and 2002 London Marathons, 2nd in the 2002 Chicago Marathon, and won the Berlin Marathon in September of 2003. My point is, Ritz is improving and that's does matter. He's not running slowly, and in the future probably will run a couple minutes faster, when he works out the logistics of fuel, fluids, etc. Regardless, I plan to be supportive, of a hard-working American runner who puts himself on the line against the best in the world.

I just searched (which I should have done earlier) and found this out about Tergat:

2001: London - 2nd place

2001: Chicago - 2nd place

2002: London - 2nd place

2002: Chicago - 4th place

2003: London - 4th place

2003: Berlin - 1st place and world's best time.

It wasn't until his 6th, not 2nd, marathon before he won a race and set a world's best.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Tergat

Hall at Boston said he would try to break 4:00 for the mile later this summer; Ritz should do the same and run another greater 2 mile.

Coach D wrote:

Tergat ran 2:05 in his second marathon and he broke the WR on his third. Khannouchi also set the WR on his third, Geb on his 5th. The marathon is not easy on the body and one does not get that many high quality attempts.

2:10 was a great time when Malmo was running. The discussion here is an indication of the extent to which the Africans have raised the bar.

No, the discussion here is an indication of the extent of what a bunch of stupid, bitter, small-minded, petty little douches most of the posters are. Also, how little they understand running or physiology, even the fundamentals.

Jesus Christ, reading this garbage is like having Comedy Central do a special on running every night on my computer.

You guys suck. You guys pile on and criticize every chance you get.

I didn't want to but I will say it. What other runners have ...

won the National 2-mile outdoors THREE YRS?

ran an 8:41 as a junior?

Ran three FL Championships? Won two of them?

ran 1:54, 4:05, 8:41, 14:10 as a junior?

Been undefeated by HS'ers for two yrs?

Ran 13:44 for a near HS-record?

Placed third in the WJCCC against overage foriegners? As a HS'er?

Ran a 13:27 as a college freshman? Has any freshman beside Nyambui or something ever run that fast as a freshman?

run 27th at the WCCC as a freshman?

As a frosh he placed 4th in XC, 4th in indoor, and 4th in outdoor 5k. Losing to the same people each time.

Run 27:38 as a third-year student? Or any year? In his debut at 10k no less?

How many runners have 8:11y, 13:16, 27:35 by age 24? Or any age?

How many place 9th in the Olympics?

I get it that there are probably 50 men in the world who could have performed at his Beijing level, most of them would be Ethiopian and Kenyan and Moroccan runners left off the team.

I get it that he has been injured often and been injured at innopportune times. I get that.

What I don't get is how someone can be nearly the fastest 2-miler all-time as a 10th, 11th and 12th grader and also in the 5k and win National Championships at ever stop along the way (HS, College and Pro) in every discipline and people don't think he will at least be at the level of those before him (mainly Salazar and Virgin)?

When someone runs 13:44 in HS and 13:27 the next year (the best in U.S. history) he has as good a chance as anyone to keep going and keep getting U.S. best marks. Will he? I have no idea, but I know based on his 12 years of running at the highest levels that he has a chance.

I tell you another thing that I said 10 yrs ago: If he got good enough to start a race at 14:08 and then drop a 4:25 mile near the end of a marathon I would no longer be a fan because I would know that he had gone to the darkside. Has he already? Don't know, but if he could run with the top people in the world right now I WOULD KNOW.

You guys crack me up who tear down people like DR who are trying their hardest and Hudson who is coaching the best he can ... if you knew either of them they aren't arrogant blowhards. If they say they were shooting for 2:06 then it is because someone asked them. I have seen Ritz run many times when he was younger and he NEVER bragged, NEVER talked trash ... he was actually very boring for a 17-year-old running 4:09 indoors.

I realize that just because Hudson and Ritz are faster than all of us they are not beyond criticism or discussion, but if all of you are soooo much better at managing and developing distance running talent ... what happened to all of you? Seriously?

Have you really been that sterling with your own potential that you can take constant pot-shots at somebody this good?

You guys come across as the typical "superfans" from Football and basketball that scream at the screen and critique games they never even played. You also seem like a bunch of know-it-all NO-TALENT ass-clowns.

Give it a rest and discuss something you know about ... because you have never run a sub-30 10k and then kept going for 20 more miles.

ok mr. rockford. although as you should know by now... what he did in high school and college doesnt mean crap today. its all about what he does now. not back then... but now. so get off your high rockford horse and come back to reality.

gtfo wrote:

ok mr. rockford. although as you should know by now... what he did in high school and college doesnt mean crap today. its all about what he does now. not back then... but now. so get off your high rockford horse and come back to reality.

Right now (or at least last year) he was 10th in the Olympics.