I hope that most of you are wrong and that the trials will not be awarded to New York in November. If this is in fact the deal then something smells bad. If New York does a great job it still smells bad because it is NOT what most of the athletes want. The end Never justifies the means.
if you actually read what i wrote, i never stated or insinuated that anyone other than those that were sent were the ones that deserved to go. I whole heartedly agree that marathoning was at an all time low, and is only now on an upswing (at least on the men's side).
Saying people suck is one thing, but saying that they suck because they decided not to prepare themselves is another, and that's what i take issue with. I agree that most at the 2000 trials were not worthy of being olympians. All but 1, as it turns out. I'm sure everyone in the trials races in 2000 prepared themselves as best they could and worked as hard as they could. All I'm really saying, i guess, is that there are a load of reasons why someone might not run a great marathon on any given day, many of those reasons of course have to do with one's preparation. But a number of those can also be completely beyond one's control. I've known runners who have had stomach and intestinal issues even though they used the same stuff they always use. I've known runners who had blister problems even though they used the same socks and shoes as usual. I know people who have fallen ill, gotten hit by cars, had family issues, been dumped, and the list goes on.
fyi - not the 'no one' who normally posts here - that be me.
Actually no one was me. I was in a rush to post and remembered there was an article a few weeks back that said it would be revealed on the 4th. I can't find the article though. Either way it is good we are discussing this.
On point that has not been addressed in the OT Marathon, and needs to be, is the fact that it puts US runners at a disadvantage in the Marathon Majors scoring. (this may not be a huge deal now but within a year or two I see the Marathon Majors prise purse growing and deepening - Say 3 or 5 deep and $1 M to the winner)
The way it is shaping up it will take a good time/full effort for the top guys to make the US team (with several failing to qualify) given the field will now likely include: KK, Meb, Abdi, Culpepper, Shay, Sell, Browne and others. It looks like it will take sub 2:10 type of times make the team (or similar effort).
So this is a major effort for anyone. Given that most top marathoners only run 2 marathons per year all of their marathons are scoring efforts (4) under the Marathon Majors rules. Except for Americans who have run the trials. So they will have a major effort that can't earn them points in the Marathon Majors Championship.
There is only two ways around this as I see it. Hold the trials as part of either NYC, Boston or Chicago races or make the team be the top US performer at each of those three races (giving guys a potential of 3 shots to make the team).
At least there will be a Trials. Some people make valid arguments about a selection system but I feel that generates a lot more controversy.
Name one person that is qualified to be a selector if we went to a selection process.
Joe Vigil thought that Shay would make the team.
He wasn't in the top 10.
Kevin Hanson thought that Brian Sell would make the team.
He wasn't in the top 10.
My point is that no one is smart enough to pick our best three athletes. THAT IS THE BEAUTY OF A TRIAL.
Of course every coach is going to say their athlete is going to make it so that isn't a great example.
The trial is where its at... its the best and easiest way to create a team without using any type of subjective reasoning...
Plus, it also resorts back to good ole' fashion racing and not time trials... We've gotten away from the difference between racing well and running fast... I'd rather see meb take second in athens racing smart than take 15th but running the american record...
As far as the location... I don't think it matters as much as to where as it does to when... hosting the trials in November is a piss poor idea... especially because it elimates chicago from the qualifying period, and what better race to take a last chance qualifier at than Chi-town. I would venture to say that if you have the trials in november, your going to have signifigantly less qualifiers, and then we'll all be on the bored screaming about how shitty our marathoning has become again... because we only qulified 50 guys instead of 200 like back in the 80's...
Personally, I hope boston gets it... good time of year, plenty of time to rest before the olympics, and huge publicity holding it the same weekend as the boston marathon.. what better venue is there than the oldest and most famous marathon in the world...
giddy wrote:
Plus, it also resorts back to good ole' fashion racing and not time trials... We've gotten away from the difference between racing well and running fast... I'd rather see meb take second in athens racing smart than take 15th but running the american record...
Post of the day. Between the penguins and elites looking for records, the concept of racing is being trivialized.
"Keep_Going" said
"Lasalle Bank also runs the Shamrock Shuffle 8K and the Distance Classic half-marathon in Chicago....so the last point is not correct."
When you can demonstrate that the LSB SS and the Distance Classic pay for one or two dozen of the best US runners to come in, like the USA 8ks and the Circle of Friends Mini do, I'll admit to being incorrect.
When LaSalle Bank sets up a televised Mottram vs. Webb showdown, like the NYRR did last Sept., I'll admit to being WAY incorrect.
But until that time...
Don't be so defensive Joe. We all know you and the rest of the NY running scene are the best. You remind us all the time.
I have to say that Jim Estes was not the Race Director for Papa Johns at the time it was measured short. Karen Sherman from Papa John's was. An lets be honest. The outcome of the races that were run on that course wouldnt have been any different.
Where to begin???????????????? wrote:
JIM ESTES
Thought to be the lap dog for Mary Wittenburg. Has never turned down a free perk. Has accepted payments from NYRR to assure the trials. Defended his short 10 mile race for 3 years promising all of us that the course was accurate. Proved to be dead wrong.
Now you can claim that my comments are not the view of all of the folks on this board and that is fair. However you claimed that this committee is respected by ALL and that is horse shit.
He was the elite athlete coordinator. Never the Race Driector.
Papa John Pizza. wrote:
I have to say that Jim Estes was not the Race Director for Papa Johns at the time it was measured short. Karen Sherman from Papa John's was. An lets be honest. The outcome of the races that were run on that course wouldnt have been any different.
Where to begin???????????????? wrote:JIM ESTES
Thought to be the lap dog for Mary Wittenburg. Has never turned down a free perk. Has accepted payments from NYRR to assure the trials. Defended his short 10 mile race for 3 years promising all of us that the course was accurate. Proved to be dead wrong.
Now you can claim that my comments are not the view of all of the folks on this board and that is fair. However you claimed that this committee is respected by ALL and that is horse shit.
test
Hello? Is this thing on?
Joe McV.
You are right. The Shuffle has been and the Distance Classic will be used to set things up for the elite marathoners. LaSalle likes bringing guys/gals in to show them the city and the course in hopes they like what they see and want to come back in October. The Distance Classic sets up perfectly for a tuneup half since it will always be about two months before the marathon. It will more than likely have an elite presence as the years go on. LaSalle Bank is a corporation, and while Carey Pinkowski and everyone else does a lot for the running community, their vision will never be the same as the NYRR.
This one says Mid April.
http://www.coolrunning.com/engine/3/3_1/top-us-marathons-express-.shtml
So does this one.
http://www.american-trackandfield.com/news/trialsmarathon08interest.html
Same.
http://www.usatf.org/news/view.aspx?DUid=USATF_2005_12_13_12_11_39
Here we go. This one says April 3rd.
http://www.newsnet5.com/news/7057652/detail.html
This one just says April.
http://www.runnersworld.com/cda/daily_news/0,5039,0-0-0-0----01-16-2006,00.html
atownrunnin wrote:
LaSalle Bank is a corporation, and while Carey Pinkowski and everyone else does a lot for the running community, their vision will never be the same as the NYRR.
That is a good thing. NYRR "vision" is 100% self serving and those that can't see that are probably receiving something from them. More credit to Hansons for seeing through the B.S.
Of course previous posts and releases have said "October, November, December and after the first of the year."