I went from 60 miles a week to 146 miles last week.

You won't do it but train for the mile.

I think you are crazy! You may be suprised how fast you go for a marathon if you are a low 31/15 runner. If your just now introducing mileage like this with your speed and as long as you can stay healthy a 245 will be a jog. Good luck

Magic is in the man, not the miles.

Need to run fast to run a fast marathon.. not jog 150mpw

Nate the great blur collar wrote:

Magic is in the man, not the miles.

Need to run fast to run a fast marathon.. not jog 150mpw

Yep.

Hey desperate,

All the best with your quest. You might take some inspiration from this athlete who focused on one race, did alot of slow miles and won the big one.

http://www.nytimes.com/1996/01/31/sports/track-and-field-slow-but-steady-trip-to-the-millrose-3000.html

There were always the dreams to escort Brad Schlapak through his runs over the Newton hills on the Boston Marathon course. There were tempo runs over the sometimes-muddied trails at Franklin Park and the times when he'd go to the country for the solitude of long-distance runs. There was always tomorrow's race.

He was Eamonn Coghlan's rabbit in Madison Square Garden, a perennial in the twilight meets at Northeastern University's Solomon Track in Dedham. He was the kid who first started to dream when he was growing up in the central Massachusetts community of Baldwinville. Yesterday, on a resplendent and chilled afternoon, in a race over the familiar turf of Franklin Park, Schlapak's dream became a magical reality.

Overhauled by defender and prerace favorite Reuben Reina with 100 meters to go in the 98th men's US Cross-Country Championships, Schlapak stormed through some slop in the homestretch to become the first Northeastern alum to win one of the oldest athletic competitions on this continent. The last New England native to win the men's competition was Rhode Islander Bob Black, who posted his second victory 47 years ago.

The sacrifices all paid off at age 29 for Schlapak, a loan servicer at the Brookline Savings Bank who long has shared a rambling house in Brighton Center with the running multitudes.

"Next to making the Olympic team," said Schlapak as he stood in T-shirt and mud-splattered shorts, oblivious to the cold air in Franklin Park, "this is the biggest thing. Ever since I've been in college I've watched this race, and I've run it the last seven or eight years. I've just wanted to win it so bad for so many years."

Win it he did, the leader of the 19 who broke the previous 10-kilometer record (29:24) set by Providence's Mark Carroll in the IC4As Nov. 11. Schlapak's 28:49 led Arkansas graduate Reina (28:50), former Villanova runner Terrance Mahon (28:53), Brian Baker (28:56), 1990 winner and Dartmouth graduate Bob Kempainen (28:58) and Attleboro native Mark Coogan (29:02), who was a force until he was tripped and fell with 800 meters to go.

"Schlapak's win was a triumph for everyone who has ever laced on the shoes for a wintry jog in this region. It also earned him a trip to the 32d World Championships next March in Cape Town. He did it on high (120 miles per week) mileage, but with zero racing in his recent portfolio. He's been a face in the crowd who just happened to run his personal race for the ages on this special day.

"I haven't raced this season," said Schlapak, who gradually moved up to catch Kempainen and Reina as they neared the finish. "I put all my eggs in one basket. We were all bunched up. I was moving around. It seemed slow. I just sat around and waited . . . and waited and waited. When Reuben came up on me with 100 to go I said, `I've been waiting too damn long. I've been waiting eight years for this.'

"I'm so glad I did it here. I love this course. I love the people here. I've been living here for 10 years. I've raced well in the past off doing no racing at all and a lot of people told me, `That's a real dumb thing to do. You should get a few races in.' I did this on purpose, and I had confidence in myself. I felt good today. I did a lot of tempo runs on the course and tried to get every inch of this course down so I knew everything. I knew Reuben was going to be coming, because he has a scorcher of a kick."

Reina, who finished eighth in the 5,000 meters at the 1991 World Track Championships in Tokyo, seemed perfectly positioned for a repeat victory throughout the race. "It was just like last year," said Reina. "I thought I was going to pull it off like I did last year. I just couldn't sustain the kick I had started. When I went, I felt he was tiring, and I felt I had won. He surprised me. I didn't know who he was. It's upsetting to lose knowing how well I did feel."

Hodgie-san wrote:

Reina, who finished eighth in the 5,000 meters at the 1991 World Track Championships in Tokyo

Yes, IN THE HEATS, so Reina was not in the final. I have to mention that a great race in the final by a fellow-Finn Risto Ulmala, who was 7th (13.33,46).

I can't believe this thread is still alive. I thought the OP would have been walking around in a cast by now.

If 100 miles a week is good, 200 miles a week is twice as good.

Alberto_Ruppizar wrote:

If 100 miles a week is good, 200 miles a week is twice as good.

Not. The law of diminishing returns.

Nate the great blur collar wrote:

Magic is in the man, not the miles.

Need to run fast to run a fast marathon.. not jog 150mpw

The magic is on the man who does the miles. I've been doing workouts if you've read this thread at all, but that wouldn't help you get your point across would it?

tuygbinjokml wrote:

Alberto_Ruppizar wrote:

If 100 miles a week is good, 200 miles a week is twice as good.

Not. The law of diminishing returns.

I'm on pace for 125 this week. Just did 2 x 3 mile yesterday in an average of 18:30. Felt very easy and didn't push too much at all.

Keep going. I like the experimental nature of what you're doing. There's only one way to find out if you can handle the load. My best runs have always come like the day after I've logged my biggest mileage week to-date. Some people respond to this kind of thing better than others.

bump

Dick Fitzwell wrote:

Keep going. I like the experimental nature of what you're doing. There's only one way to find out if you can handle the load. My best runs have always come like the day after I've logged my biggest mileage week to-date. Some people respond to this kind of thing better than others.

I agree with you. I usually feel awesome after a good session the day before.

I've always had a great talent at handling immense loads of work in high school and college. I had 4 straight years of gradual, uninterrupted training throughout high school, and then even more gradual training in college. I've never been seriously injured, and have never had to take a day off against my will. I used to joke that the cure to all injuries was to just run farther. I like to think what I lack in talent for speed I have in durability. Looks like it's time to test just how durable.

I have 7 weeks until Boston. The plan is to have the last two weeks be pretty light, easy mileage with probably a shorter tempo and maybe a few hard 400s. I plan on spending the next 5 weeks cramming as much work as possible to see if I can get back into good shape and stop being a wuss. I think if I can fit 5 weeks of 120+ miles I can at least have a shot at sub 2:40, which isn't exactly what I should be running, but I don't know if I could break 2:55 right this instant.

update?

I love your enthusiasm, and I love the idea of testing ones limits. There is truth to the saying "you can only find your limits by risking going too far"...

However, learn from other's mistakes, and the words of wise folks (not me, but I quote one below).

Below are a few pasages from "The Self-Made Olympian", by Ron Daws. If you don't know, Daws followed the Lydiard system to run big miles and qualify for the 1968 Olympic Marathon. He, and Lydiard, don't shy away from mileage, and throw out phrases like "Miles Make the Champions". Pick up the book - it is very inspiring, and instructive. Might help you.

From page 69 ("Base Training"):

"During this phase of training it is important that you do not attempt too much, too soon. Marathon training sometimes has an effect similar to that of dropping a tank engine into a Pinto. Cardiovascular efficiency and endurance are apt to get ahead of mechanical development. In simple terms, it means that a runner's energy capactiy can outstrip the ability of the muscles and tendons to withstand the strain. This puts the runner in a precarious position. He has the capacity and tendency to run off at speeds his body cannot withstand. This is what happened to the high school boy mentioned earlier who upped his mileage to 144 a week. He didn't feel exhausted afterwards; his achilles tendon just couldn't take it."

"On the other hand, this training is not jogging around either. Good runners rarely go slower than 7:00 a mile, and some of the work is 5:00-6:00-minute miling. I can't tell you in a book how to be sure you are going fast enough without overdoing it. You must learn by trial and error. But if you err too far, you may have to wait until another season to put to work what you have learned."

---------------------------

Earlier, on page 44-45, Daws described the high school boy referenced above:

"Some years ago, a high school boy wrote to ask if I would coach him for the state 2-mile track championship the following June. I began him on the roads..."

The kid ran a time trial, despite the Daw's plan, and Daws corrected him.

"...We reviewed his current goal, which was mileage, and I finally won him over."

"Apparently, he took the mileage business too seriously, for he nearly doubled what the schedule called for, boasting in the next letter that the previous week totaled 144 miles (of which several were quality). This time I crayoned my warning in bold red print 'You are running too far and too fast!" I predicted that if he didn't cut back, he'd either be crippled by race time or completely worn down."

"'You will be the fittest guy in the bleachers come State Meet,' I concluded. Achilles trouble got to him before my letter, and he was in the bleachers."

"...he got so fit he thought himself indestructible until the moment he broke down. The injury was sudden, and by the time he eased up it was too late. (His condition at that point was so good that after a month of rest and jogging he still set the Outstate indoor two-mile record in April with 9:42. After that, his tendon really took over.)"

Last week, I ended up hitting 128. It was ugly, but I did it.

I took a day off yesterday, and ran a hard 16 miler today. I'm doing a 6 mile tempo run during an 18 miler tomorrow, and hopefully without the snow this time I can hit about 5:50-6:00 pace.

I'd like to think that I'm in pretty great shape right now, I'm just not fast. Does that make sense? Like I could run forever and withstand a beating, but I haven't felt fast yet. I think when I cut my miles a lot more in 5 weeks I'll probably feel pretty darn good. I've decided to keep up these antics until about 2-3 weeks out from the race and then start trying to get recovered and fresh. I'll see if it works, but who knows. All I know is that I started this build up pretty out of shape and it was either run shitty miles and run a 2:45, or take a risk and see if I can get closer to 2:39.

I appreciate everyone who is supporting my idiocy, it helps me keep a little bit more motivated on days I'm feeling not so great.

2 sides wrote:

From page 69 ("Base Training"):

"During this phase of training it is important that you do not attempt too much, too soon. Marathon training sometimes has an effect similar to that of dropping a tank engine into a Pinto. Cardiovascular efficiency and endurance are apt to get ahead of mechanical development. In simple terms, it means that a runner's energy capactiy can outstrip the ability of the muscles and tendons to withstand the strain.

True. This is why you shouldn´t do too much, because the muscles and joints and bones adapt SLOWER than metabolic systems. Taking down days and weeks are important on this also.

Sir Mix-a-Lot wrote:

I can't believe this thread is still alive. I thought the OP would have been walking around in a cast by now.

Why? He is barely moving when he runs, its like walking, no real damage to your legs.

Learn something.