What did it take for YOU to break 2:30 marathon?

Long runs, lots of 10 mile tempo runs, a peak just over 100mpw, and proper hydration/gel on the course got me under 2:30 for the first time. Also, going out slow.

My main concern with my ability to hit 2:30 in the long term is my muscle mass. I'm going to have to find a way to get rid of it at some point.

I'd also be interested to hear the height/weight of people who've run sub 2:30.

Height 6'1

weight 148lbs

... but thats my race day weight.

Right now im fat... at about 156 pounds

categorically wrote:

Also, going out slow.

how slow? Did you negative split?

What about others?

sorry, if you went out slow it's dumb to ask just in general if you ran any negative splits.

A better question is how fast did you run the first and second halves (especially if hills didn't make a big difference on the course)?

HRM...... wrote:

What did it take for YOU to break 2:30 marathon?

miles/week?

years training?

non-running training?

Training style?

etc.?

Did you put in years of work and still weren't able to do it?

Started running in sixth grade, was not an immediate success. I got to 18:XX / 39:XX (5k/10k) by end of 7th grade. Also ran 25ks (December and May) and marathon in 3:13. I ran a lot though to get there (this was in the 80s).

Had a bad yr in 8th grade. Knee injury. Was sidelined for most of yr, but ran 5:15 for 1600 in May.

Committed completely to training by 9th grade, ran 40-50 a week during winter of 9th grade yr. Ran every day, plus weights.

Ran 60 mpw every week for 12 weeks during summer before 10th grade, plus weights, drills, and swimming. Got to 16:40 on a real XC course that Fall. 60-70 mpw over the winter again, plus weights and swimming. Made it to 9:50 for 3200 that spring. Did not make State Meet.

Had big plans for the next two yrs. Ran 75-85 a week for that summer, plus weights (3x a week)and 300/500 pushups/situps each day and 3000m swimming twice a week. Went to a XC camp at the end of July. Made it to 15:49 for a real XC course that Fall.

That winter I ran 70-80 consistently. swam in the mornings (three X per week -- 1750 yds). Also raced indoors (1600-3200), and training road races (Saturdays) one-three times per week (mostly once).

Winter training looked like this:

M:

AM - 1750 yd swimming hard pace

PM - 10 mi easy; weights 30 min continuous; 500/300 situps/ pushups every day

T:

PM - 10 miles at hard pace (55-56 min) on hills

or indoor meet (mile in 4:26-32 or 2mile in 9:35-50)

W:

AM - 1750 yd swimming hard pace

PM - 10 mi easy; weights 30 min continuous; 500/300 situps/ pushups every day

T:

PM - 10 mi hard on flat OR :10 easy/:45 Fartlek/ :10 easy = :65

(I did stuff like 3:00 hard/3:00 at 6:00 pace, or 5-5-4-4-3-3-2-2 hard/ 2:00 easy, or 15x2:00 hard /1:00 easy -- this was always done at about 5k pace, not faster than 5:00 per mile); 500/300 situps/ pushups every day

(sometimes we had a second indoor meet - but that was rare and I would run whatever event I DID NOT run on Tues.)

F:

AM - 1750 yd swimming hard pace

PM - 10 mi easy; weights 30 min continuous; 500/300 situps/ pushups every day

Sa:

AM - 5-8 miles at hard pace (5:10-5:30) on hills

or "training road race" (anywhere from 4x2mile road relay with partner up to 10 miles; one 25k in December)

Su:

AM - 14-15 mile long run for 10 weeks (Nov-Dec-Jan); then progressed to 15-17-19-21-23 over Feb-earlyMarch; then back to 14-15 during outdoor (lateMarch-May).

These long runs and the 55min 10-milers were what convinced me to try the marathon. Other key results were a 15:27 road 5k, 1:28 25k in December, and a bunch of 3200s in 9:35-50. I also trained (Sat-Sun) with a group of guys who were 22-28 yrs old who were all trying to qualify for Boston (2:50 at the time). They were looking at the Annual list for the marathon one day after a long run and asked me what I thought I could do. I said, "2:35". They laughed.

I would have run in the AMs as opposed to swimming, but I had had a health scare in the Fall and thought that swimming (in the AMs) was playing it safe. I also liked the way it made me feel. Grosse Pointe North had had a guy win XC State Meet one year who was an outstanding 200/500 swimmer (supposedly) and I guess I tried it because of that. I was able to swim in an outdoor 50m pool at the University in the summer and that felt like good training, especially on Sundays after long runs.

My summer training before XC was very much like this, but I ran twice a day 1-3X a week, most weeks and on those days I would run 5-6-AM + 7-PM, or 5-6 + 10, or sometimes 10 + 5. Sometimes it was TWO tempo runs per day, sometimes it was just 2 easy runs. Because of this it ended up being more miles (~75-85).

That Spring before the big outdoor meets had started and after Indoor State Meet (ran the Mile in 4:25) I ran a marathon in 2:31:56. So, I did not break 2:30, but it was close and it was my second try at the distance (first was 7th grade).

To answer your questions:

Best -- 2:31:56

miles/week? 70-85 for about a year

years training? 5.5 (age 17)

non-running training? weights, pushups/situps, swimming

Training style? strict-Lydiard -- since 9th grade

etc.? I had a supplement plan that I used (and this was 29 yrs ago). I think it was one thing that helped me improve 1 min in XC between 10th and 11th.

I got a chronic illness before senior yr and was never able to run again, much less chase 2:30. I had planned on shooting for 2:30 and then 2:25 and then 2:20, and trying for the Oly Trials in the marathon in 88 or 92 depending on how well my 5k/10k progressed, or I would have liked to try the Steeple. I am fairly sure I would have been able to make sub-2:19 (that is what it took in '84), now with 30 yrs of hindsight. But not sure I could have run ~8:45/13:40/28:40. I had two age-24 friends in 1984 that made the Trials in the 5k/10k/Marathon. They went 13:40/28:40/2:15 and 13:42/28:45/2:17. I still hold out hope that I might recover and run again, but I don't dream about 2:30.

1 sub 230 in 1 try wrote:

Enough talent to run 4:10 for the mile, lots of banked miles from previous running endeavors over the last 15 years, 4-5 month buildup with a stretch of 10 weeks averaging 70-75 mpw, a long run each week including 6 runs of 20+, a tempo run most weeks, no cross training.

YEAH RIGHT. You don't have to be anywhere near a 4:10 miler to run 2:30. Sorry. And if you said that because you've run sub 2:30 and think you have the talent to run sub 4:10, think again. Sorry.

Minimum 80 per week up to 100 or so. Lots of 13-15 mile tempo runs, not much in the way of intervals. The first time I broke 2:30 was spring break after indoor track season- I had been running strong workouts but racing indoor 2 miles like crap (9:40s). Ran 30:20 for 6 miles outdoors after that.

No offense, but it seems that many people need to run 100 miles or more to break 2:30. That sounds like an awful lot -

it is like elites run 2:12?!?!?

What did it take for me to break a 2:30 marathon? A really great dream...but then I woke up.

ggg wrote:

No offense, but it seems that many people need to run 100 miles or more to break 2:30. That sounds like an awful lot -

it is like elites run 2:12?!?!?

"A lot" of people don't have the V02max or other benefits that elites are born with. It takes a lot of miles to build up strength for mortals.

I have run 2:30 off of 100-105mpw with lots of long, difficult workouts. I was trying pretty much as hard as I could given my work load and family stuff. Not to say that I couldn't have been tougher and run faster, but it was an honest effort.

I have a buddy who ran 2:15 off of about 80-85mpw with workouts that were no more intense than mine. Of course he had been a sub-4 miler as well.

I almost didn't read this thread because I'm pretty sure it's beyond my capability at this point. It's a good read anyway.

I think I could have gotten there, but I stopped being serious too soon and got serious again too late. 4:42/9:51/16:21 in HS, but then faded out while going to a University with a team over my head. Started running again at about 30 but had a max week of 48 or so until I was about 37/8.

Currently I'm chasing 2:4x (48-49 most likely) and will be maxing out at about 105 in training. I am still improving through consistency and increasing mileage so it will be interesting to see where I end up. I can imagine in the 2:3x's being possible (if unlikely) but knowing some others who have been around 2:30 I don't know if anything could get me there at this point.

HRM...... wrote:

I'd like to hit a 2:30 at a late fall or early winter 2013 marathon, but if it takes 3 years instead of 2 that's fine. If I train optimally and bottom out at 2:40 that's fine. I don't really have a hard goal. I just need to exercise for 2-3 hours a day to enjoy life.

Background isn't super relevant.

Actually, background is the MOST relevant.

jorvack wrote:

The tempo/threshold is super important. I worked up to 8 miles on my own at 1/2 marathon pace.

taper

I've seen a lot of blogs/workouts by elites too who do this type of thing, (tempos even up to 9 miles at half marathon pace). I don't understand how people do that? I feel like if I was 8 miles in on PR pace, well I might as well do that other 5. I know easier said than done, but in two half marathons I ran I felt like the most stressful part was getting to 10 miles on pace (not going too fast or too slow) and then after that the pressure is off because I can just basically crank it home because I don't have to worry about having enough left.

My half PR is 67:50 form my 2nd one, so about 5:10 pace. I just can't picture myself going out and running an 8 or 9 mile tempo at 5:10 pace and it being tempo effort. I do a lot of long progressions where I may close at 5 minute pace or under, but usually start way over that and maybe average closer to 5:20's.

Am I just a wimp who isn't working out hard enough? Or am I building a 8 mile tempo at half pace up to be harder than it is? I obviously COULD do it; I just envision the effort that would go into it would be more than I want to put into any one workout. If I'm going to go 8 or 9 miles at goal 1/2 pace I might as well sign up for a race and go all the way.

1 sub 230 in 1 try wrote:

Enough talent to run 4:10 for the mile, lots of banked miles from previous running endeavors over the last 15 years, 4-5 month buildup with a stretch of 10 weeks averaging 70-75 mpw, a long run each week including 6 runs of 20+, a tempo run most weeks, no cross training.

Enough talent to run 4:10 for the mile to break 2:30 in the marathon? Is this a typo? I could not come anywhere near a 4:10 right now (possibly ever) and I could go out and break 2:30 without too much concern. Granted, I am not a speed guy, but still, you DEFINITELY DO NOT NEED 4:10 mile talent to be a sub 2:30 marathoner. I'm not going to look up the Daniels or McMillian conversions, but I'm sure they'll back me up and then some on this one.

How? wrote:

Am I just a wimp who isn't working out hard enough? Or am I building a 8 mile tempo at half pace up to be harder than it is? I obviously COULD do it; I just envision the effort that would go into it would be more than I want to put into any one workout. If I'm going to go 8 or 9 miles at goal 1/2 pace I might as well sign up for a race and go all the way.

I'd say yes to questions one and two.

8 miles is not even 45 minutes and still 25 minutes + less than a race. What's the problem here? Man up and work out hard. If you're too mentally fragile to do that, then sure, just do a race instead.

Thank you wrote:

There's another one wrote:

Why do so many idiots on Letsrun make stupid statements like this? Options:

1. You don't know what the word "slow" means.

2. You have a negative self-image and no matter what you do you think you suck.

3. You're an arrogant pr!ck who wants to insult the greatest number of people possible.

AAAA....MEN!!!!!!! Thank You!!!! +1000 I am sick of all the pious self loathing on this site.

I made this quote because I was always slower than the people I trained with, yet faster than these same people at the marathon. When you spend 8 years trying to break 15 and fail multiple times, you feel slow. The fact that I offended some folks means I must have been faster than I thought!

8 miles at half marathon pace is not a tempo, that's a race. Really dumb workout.