retched wrote:
That's only because "Duke" rhymes with "bulimia"
I thought you were going to say that Duke rhymes with puke.
retched wrote:
That's only because "Duke" rhymes with "bulimia"
I thought you were going to say that Duke rhymes with puke.
retched wrote:
That's only because "Duke" rhymes with "bulimia"
naught but a thought wrote:
I thought you were going to say that Duke rhymes with puke.
A joke! he he he ... I get jokes ... he he he.
not so fast........ wrote:
answer?? wrote:ok--so men have alcohol problems-they get tossed off team--nobody talks about the coach causing a toxic atmosphere which drove the guy to drink----if the women's team has eating issues, coach must do something and/or share in the blame?
and to the coach, you are a 4 yr employee--it as simple as that-------i think most women are coddled as high school athletes, where success is easier, and all of a sudden they get thrown in a system where they are "getting paid" amd production deficiencies are met with criticism, and they cannot handle......guys have same issues, and if they booze/ get fat, nobody complains when the coach says hit the road------if female reacts by trying to goose performance/cope via eating issues, the coach shares in the blame? you are 18-23 yrs old. deal with it--the guys do------transfer, quit, or figure it out-------nobody is arguing that the mens team doesn't have members who may partake in destructive coping behaviors, but no one expects Randy Thomas to arrange for them a trip to alcohol rehab
You are totally off point. The main driver in the womens eating issues are pressure from the coach to lose weight coupled with their desire to perform well in return for the scholarship they recieved, they feel indebted to the program! He's not pressuring the mens team to drink alchohol. The coach is fueling the anxiety and insecurites regarding weight. Didn't you read about the coach's comment "she's 10lbs away from all-american". You can't compare alcoholism and eating disorders. They think they need to lose weight to help the team/make the team/please the coach. It's pretty clear.
The author, Danielle, did not have eating disorder issues. The coach told her to lose "some" weight to improve her performance. Randy Thomas did not tell Jennifer (the anorexic) to lose any weight. And who's to say Danielle didn't put on the "freshman fifteen" her freshman year....we don't know her weight as a senior in HS or as a freshman or sophomore at BC.....she may well have put on weight during her BC days which did hinder her running performance.
What's wrong with telling a college athlete to gain or lose weight if you are their coach. Football coaches are always telling players to gain or lose weight...it is a part of sport.
The author, Danielle, did not have eating disorder issues. The coach told her to lose "some" weight to improve her performance. Randy Thomas did not tell Jennifer (the anorexic) to lose any weight. And who's to say Danielle didn't put on the "freshman fifteen" her freshman year....we don't know her weight as a senior in HS or as a freshman or sophomore at BC.....she may well have put on weight during her BC days which did hinder her running performance.
What's wrong with telling a college athlete to gain or lose weight if you are their coach. Football coaches are always telling players to gain or lose weight...it is a part of sport.[/quote]
Not true! The coach calls Jennifer's dad freshman year about her supposed weight gain. And Jennifer states in the story that this triggered her eating disorder.
also, you don't know that the author doesn't have an eating disorder. It sure looks like she's in the beginning stages of one.
not so fast........ wrote:
The author, Danielle, did not have eating disorder issues. The coach told her to lose "some" weight to improve her performance. Randy Thomas did not tell Jennifer (the anorexic) to lose any weight. And who's to say Danielle didn't put on the "freshman fifteen" her freshman year....we don't know her weight as a senior in HS or as a freshman or sophomore at BC.....she may well have put on weight during her BC days which did hinder her running performance.
What's wrong with telling a college athlete to gain or lose weight if you are their coach. Football coaches are always telling players to gain or lose weight...it is a part of sport.
Not true! The coach calls Jennifer's dad freshman year about her supposed weight gain. And Jennifer states in the story that this triggered her eating disorder.[/quote]
I thought the coach called Danielle's dad??????
Is this the offical LR soap opera?
Silly Old Fossil wrote:
The author, Danielle, did not have eating disorder issues. The coach told her to lose "some" weight to improve her performance. Randy Thomas did not tell Jennifer (the anorexic) to lose any weight. And who's to say Danielle didn't put on the "freshman fifteen" her freshman year....we don't know her weight as a senior in HS or as a freshman or sophomore at BC.....she may well have put on weight during her BC days which did hinder her running performance.
What's wrong with telling a college athlete to gain or lose weight if you are their coach. Football coaches are always telling players to gain or lose weight...it is a part of sport.
There are good and bad ways to address the issue of weight with female college runners. Personally, I would be perfectly fine with (and deeply appreciative) if my coach approached me and suggested that my performance might improve from a 5-10 lb weight loss. Such a discussion would be productive if it included setting specific weight-loss goals and a means of how I would achieve them (IE exclude refined carbohydrates, sugary sports drinks while maintaining adequate protein/calcium intake).
However, if my coach pulled me aside and told me "frankly, you need to take a long look in the mirror" or that I was "ten pounds away from being All-American in cross-country," the sentiment would certainly feel more hurtful than helpful. The cold statements from Thomas in SWOAR not only lack sensitivity, but most importantly they lack guidance. He doesn't offer any direction to his athletes on how to lose weight appropriately. You can certainly argue that it is a coach's job to tell their athletes, male or female, to lose weight in order to reap performance gains. But there are productive ways and unproductive ways in order to confront this subject with athletes. The fact that Thomas's team was plagued by eating disorders CLEARLY demonstrates that he poorly addressed the subject. If he was a good coach, he would be able to sensitively guide his athletes to their ideal performance weights without making them abuse their bodies (and minds) to do so.
Silly Old Fossil wrote:
The author, Danielle, did not have eating disorder issues.
I must have missed something major. Where did the name Danielle come from?
People are assuming that they know who the true author is, a girl named Danielle.
It's About Time wrote:
Silly Old Fossil wrote:The author, Danielle, did not have eating disorder issues.
I must have missed something major. Where did the name Danielle come from?
I've seen a lot of debate about who is to blame, but can someone offer a solution at this point in the story? If you could jump into the story, how do you get this girl back on track? Does she look up a psychologist/therapist in the phone book? That is a big step for a young girl to do on her own since her parents probably would not support such an action.
What to do? wrote:
I've seen a lot of debate about who is to blame, but can someone offer a solution at this point in the story? If you could jump into the story, how do you get this girl back on track? Does she look up a psychologist/therapist in the phone book? That is a big step for a young girl to do on her own since her parents probably would not support such an action.
Most schools have services available. Talk to a counselor. There's a system in place. No need to pull out a phone book or search online.
Her parents actually had the best solution, which is to remove herself from the situation. It's understandable, however, for a competitive runner that she would be unable to take this advice, as athletes are trained not to quit. I would suggest transferring to a more congenial program - it's unlikely, of course, that the coach would release her, so she may have to resign herself to sitting out a year and training at a club or something, but in the long term that seems like it may have been a better solution than staying in an environment which is not helping her running, academics or personal life and emotional help.
Otherwise, I guess a sports psychologist could help her work on working through her mental issues and providing her with a more positive mindset and strategies for coping with competition. A sports pysch would probably be more acceptable to her, as it doesn't have the same stigma as therapy - and her parents might well support it if she addresses it as helping her to run better.
Obviously, she took neither of these steps.
I meant "emotional health."
Karen and I did not communicate or work together throughout the 3.1 miles... I watched dejectedly as she kicked it in, ahead of me.
At the finish chute, she had the nerve to offer me a handshake. “Good race,” she cheered.
“Yeah, right,” I heard myself saying ,sarcastically. “You cut me off, and you cut off some of the course. Nice move!”
“I don’t know what you’re talking about. I was so out of it. You really made me work!”
I rolled my eyes at her backhanded compliment and walked away before I could say anything worse.
This attitude is one of my pet peeves. It's a duel meet, of course you're going to be racing your teammates. Had she beat her teammate, she wouldn't be bitter that they didn't "work together". Obviously all part of her depression, but I've had teammates with this attitude. Trying to beat each other should drive both of you to a faster time, which is good for the team. Just because a teammate beats you doesn't mean they're a bad teammate.
bonobobo wrote:
Silly Old Fossil, starving one's self is very much a coping mechanism for many people. The type-A, overachiever, upper-middle-class white teenage girl is just the stereotypical picture of an anoretic but by no means does it represent anyone. For one girl I know, the death of a very close family member triggered her ED (she's also a runner). I think I remember reading that the singer Fiona Apple's anorexia was a response to being sexually abused. If anyone's read the Marya Hornbacher book Wasted, her undiagnosed bipolar disorder had a lot to do with the development of her anorexia and bulimia.
And obesity in and of itself is not an eating disorder, but compulsive overeating or binge eating disorder certainly is.
I'll add something that I haven't seen anyone address yet: eating disorders are, in large part, about CONTROL. An eating disorder is often the result of someone feeling like something in their life is not measuring up, whether it is the result of parental standards, emotional stress, or whatever.
A number of researchers argue that the risk factors for eating disorders are the same as the risk factors for substance abuse: low self-esteem, depression, social pressures, a history of abuse, and/or unhealthy family relationships. The narrator certainly fits a few of these.
With an eating disorder, a person is trying to gain some control over his or her life. The narrator is feeling anxiety about the upcoming season, and limiting what she eats becomes (in her mind) an easy way to control the outcome of the season, win the favor of her coaches and parents, and to fit in better with the body-type of the rest of her teammates. Yes, it is a coping mechanism, especially for overachieving upper-middle class white girls who feel all sorts of body-image pressure, whether or not they are runners. It is a pathway they can take to gain some measure of control their personal and social anxieties.
Great studies. So, what exactly is your point? The issue raised was not about whether the average woman is as "bio-mechanically engineered" for running as the average man (or elite female vs. elite male).
You seem to be a little too concrete to understand the earlier posts, so I will do my best to summarize.
1) No one made the argument that women are physically equal to men at sports. (You, however, are arguing against this, and no one is disagreeing with you.)
2) People are arguing that sports are as important and fulfilling for women as they are for men, regardless of genetics. Women take sports as seriously as men, find an identity in sports, and benefit from sports in the same ways men do.
3) Using physiological arguments to suggest that women should not participate in sports but should instead stay home and have babies is sexist and antiquated.
"Evolve" does not mean simply physically evolve as in survival of the fittest; it means emotionally/mentally evolve, so, yes, adapt to changing societies.
It seems people are in agreement that the best women aren't as capable physically as the best men due to biology.
It seems many will assert that the best women are as capable as the best men when it comes to business or other mental pursuits, correct?
If so, why do women always need to ask/demand/legislate help from men to give them jobs or scholarships or whatever? Just go out and create for yourself women. Men did it and so can you, right?
rsbones wrote:
It seems people are in agreement that the best women aren't as capable physically as the best men due to biology.
It seems many will assert that the best women are as capable as the best men when it comes to business or other mental pursuits, correct?
If so, why do women always need to ask/demand/legislate help from men to give them jobs or scholarships or whatever? Just go out and create for yourself women. Men did it and so can you, right?
someone chlorinate this guy's gene pool... better yet, just bleach it.
rsbones wrote:
If so, why do women always need to ask/demand/legislate help from men to give them jobs or scholarships or whatever? Just go out and create for yourself women. Men did it and so can you, right?
To overcome the good ol' boys network.
Probably men have mostly given up or given in, for example you don't see many male runners questioning why the football programs get so much money from the schools, and they have so many players on their rosters, while track programs suffer as a result, and are at a minimal existance if that.
Good for women for standing up for themselves!