OMG, I totally wish Paula Radcliffe gets caught/outted.

Wasn't the word on the circuit that Radcliffe was on a steady stream of HgH, minimal injections to improve recovery, which is why in every interview she stated she took naps to "increase her HGH levels", which I also saw as a cover in case she got caught.

I think Paula was cheating. 2:15 is just too fast. I know the Brojos have some sort of kinship with her probably because Wejo paced her in a marathon, but as it seems any stellar performances these days is the result of cheating, and so I no longer have my head in the sand over this. Perhaps a victim of the cheating situation out there, but I no longer believe she did it without illegal help. I also think she will never be caught. She's pretty much done, and people don't really care.

3. Dibaba will never run 2:15[/quote]

Maybe but if she had trained for the marathon in 2008 could you say that?

Take a look at the stats for the other Sub 2:19 women:

Shobukhova 14:23 30:29 2:18.20

Keitany - - 30:45 2:18.37

Ndereba 15:27 31:02 2:18:47

Gelena 15:17 31:27 2:18.58

Radcliffe 14:29 30:01 2:15.25

Apart from Shobukhova none of them were anywhere near Radcliffe over the shorter distances and its not like Radcliffe was a speed merchant

Irrelephant wrote:

Why are there so many Paula Radcliffe haters? I don't see anyone questioning the increasing handful of men in the 2:04 neighborhood.

Do you realize that you answered your own question even as you asked it?

ukathleticscoach wrote:

Or C. That cycling is different to running in terms of doping.

It is, but you don't seem to get it.

In running, especially Marathons, you can train for months and peak for one day (or a window of a few days). So you can make sure that your testosterone and hematocrit is at its natural high on race day. You can't do that in a multi stage race. After the 3rd straight mountain stage, you will feel flat and treating your body with testosterone and EPO (or CERA or a blood transfusion) will help you recover quickly for the next day.

If running was a stage race with 20 miles for 10 days straight, then you would get a lot more "mileage" out of doping.

ukathleticscoach wrote:

Keitany - - 30:45 2:18.37

You can't be serious. Keitany has SPLIT faster than 30:45 in her Half Marathon. If you believe that Keitany could not break 30 then I would like to sell you a bridge.

When you've been around the sport long enough, you get to realise the way cheaters behave, speak (or don't speak) and act, when it comes to doping. Everything Radcliffe has ever done and said has indicated that she is clean, other than running extremely fast. If 2:15 is the only red flag against her, it says a lot more about the state of the sport than it does about her. Having met her, and followed her career and attitude/opinions when a doping story emerges, I would echo the Brojos belief that she is, and always was, clean. I'd be willing to give up running, and give up on the whole sport, if I was ever proved wrong.

It isn't cheating if the substance isn't banned.

Think about that for awhile.

Rojo-I have no idea whether Paula's clean. I hope she is and actually suspect that that's the case. That said, emphasizing the hard work that you saw her do not only doesn't support your case, I think it problematizes the issue of doping in sport. Lance doped but he was also a total animal on the bike. Other sports figures, including track athletes who have been caught doping, were also almost at the complete top of the game when they started doping and still had to train like beasts to be the best. Don't perpetuate some sort of myth that dopers don't have to work hard because the drugs do it for them--it's inaccurate and misleading.

rojo wrote:

I will admit statistically her record is absurd compared to other women. But the fact that she has been so outspoken her entire career against doping and to have seen her work so hard for the one week we spent with her, we are 100% believers she is clean.

rojo wrote:

1) 2:15 seems absurd but it shouldn't be.

Rojo is completely right here.

Look at EVERY OTHER world record. TYPICALLY women are 10-11% slower than men in a given event. This is remarkably consisent.

2:03:38 + 10% is around 2:16 flat, right? And 2:03:38 is hardly a freak performance. There are a lot of guys clustered there, and it could easily be 2:03-low within the year.

So in fact we shuold expect than women's WR to be about where it is. The real surprise isn't Paula's WR; it's the poor depth in women's marathoning generally. Soon enough we'll see Ethiopian and Kenyan women attacking the distance from an early age as the men are now, and 2:15 will not seem so stratospheric.

Yeah. Hard work is no indication that a person is clean. PEDs don't get rid of the need to work. In fact, PEDs allow the athlete to work more; harder, longer, more intensely.

Nutella1 wrote:

ukathleticscoach wrote:

Keitany - - 30:45 2:18.37

You can't be serious. Keitany has SPLIT faster than 30:45 in her Half Marathon. If you believe that Keitany could not break 30 then I would like to sell you a bridge.

Well firstly what about the rest don't just pick one to try and prove your point

30:45 is 1:05:00 pace not 1:05:50 which she ran. Still I agree you would expect faster than her pr but not guaranteed sub 30. If she didn't lack speed why did she avoid the track? Anyone no way does she have the talent of some of those top Ethiopians who are running low 14's for 5,000m. They would have better 10'000m times as well if they ran the race more than a couple of times year nowadays.

The women's marathon is where the men's was about 10 + years ago with the exception of Paula

Paula did spend an inordinate amount of time in Albuquerque, NM when Albuquerque was the drug capitol of the world. She hasn't been to Albuquerque in years.......hmmmmm.

Guilt through location????????

The Super wrote:

I think Paula was cheating. 2:15 is just too fast. I know the Brojos have some sort of kinship with her probably because Wejo paced her in a marathon, but as it seems any stellar performances these days is the result of cheating, and so I no longer have my head in the sand over this. Perhaps a victim of the cheating situation out there, but I no longer believe she did it without illegal help. I also think she will never be caught. She's pretty much done, and people don't really care.

You are wrong.

Woxl wrote:

Wasn't the word on the circuit that Radcliffe was on a steady stream of HgH, minimal injections to improve recovery, which is why in every interview she stated she took naps to "increase her HGH levels", which I also saw as a cover in case she got caught.

No you idiot. Sleeping increases HgH naturally.

"OMG, I totally wish Paula Radcliffe gets caught"

OMG, I totally wish you learn to write in English!

And why is no one leveling doping allegations against Ndereba?

15:27, 31:02 and 2:18:47? How many people do you know who have barely cracked 5:00 pace for 10K, yet can hold better than 5:18 pace for 26.2 miles?

Oh -- she was a marathon specialist, you say? Hmmm. That has a familiar ring to it.

Granted, Paula ran a bunch of track 10Ks, which CN did not, but she also ran 30:21 on the road and is the WR holder in that event. Her "curve" is less suspicious than Catherine the Great's.

The Guru Matt James wrote:

He beat my friends dad in the Boston Marathon that one time. That's at least one person.

I hate to be the one to break it to you, but your friend's father was on PEDs.

LDOPA wrote:

The Guru Matt James wrote:

He beat my friends dad in the Boston Marathon that one time. That's at least one person.

I hate to be the one to break it to you, but your friend's father was on PEDs.

Deep Heat doesn't count

ukathleticscoach wrote:

Apart from Shobukhova none of them were anywhere near Radcliffe over the shorter distances and its not like Radcliffe was a speed merchant

Hm. Just wondering whether you think Shobukhova is clean ...