Fight Stupidity in America wrote:
Yeah, just like in every other developed nation, pretty much all of whom have universal health care, where costs have run wildly out of control. Not to mention the tragically shorter life expectancies and dramatically higher rates of consumer dissatisfaction in these other nations.
Careful, the stupid will not get your sarcasm.
And now for a non-hysterical look at the problem of treating the near-death elderly or otherwise terminally ill with everything in the arsenal with no thought of costs (for everyone) or quality of life...
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2010/08/02/100802fa_fact_gawande
Fight Stupidity in America wrote:
Yeah, just like in every other developed nation, pretty much all of whom have universal health care, where costs have run wildly out of control. Not to mention the tragically shorter life expectancies and dramatically higher rates of consumer dissatisfaction in these other nations.
If you had anything even approaching a rational mind, you would understand that the policies of other nations are not the benchmark that America ought to shoot for. Trying to determine what type of healthcare system America should adopt by looking at the results of other countries is like trying to determine what study methods are most effective by comparing the test results of a class of students whose grades range from D- to F.
Fight Socialism in America wrote:
People should be responsible for paying for their own medical treatment throughout their lives. Only laissez-faire capitalism can make healthcare affordable to average people. The more government intervenes, the worse things are going to get.
Are you older than 35 years old? Do you have any medical issues whatsoever - even minor ones? Are you a woman? Have you ever tried getting approved for health insurance?
I doubt the answer to all these questions (even setting aside the woman question) is yes. It's easy to be libertarian when you're young and healthy, or when your big company employer takes care of everything while you doze at your desk for eight hours of zero productivity.
The care stops because the elderly don't have any money left to take, not because they are elderly.
Why shouldn't we look at what WORKS in other countries? We pay way more than anyone else, costs are rising faster than inflation, and our care isn't substantially more effective. Our system is broken and it makes sense to look at other systems to see where we should go from here.
we will all be old wrote:
Are you older than 35 years old? Do you have any medical issues whatsoever - even minor ones? Are you a woman? Have you ever tried getting approved for health insurance?
I doubt the answer to all these questions (even setting aside the woman question) is yes. It's easy to be libertarian when you're young and healthy, or when your big company employer takes care of everything while you doze at your desk for eight hours of zero productivity.
You are full of bullsh*t assumptions. In fact, I have a serious and debilitating chronic illness that threatens my ability to survive. Never for a single second have I ever believed that my personal misfortune entitles me to healthcare provided at the expense of others. Trade freedom for healthcare? Freedom is the only thing worth living for - without it, healthcare means nothing to me. You leftists have sold your souls to go the doctor as far as I'm concerned.
Azaleas wrote:
Why shouldn't we look at what WORKS in other countries? We pay way more than anyone else, costs are rising faster than inflation, and our care isn't substantially more effective. Our system is broken and it makes sense to look at other systems to see where we should go from here.
When you talk about what "WORKS," you invoke some unstated standard by which you judge success or failure. Socialist healthcare might "work" according to your utterly pathetic standards, but no socialist scheme anywhere on earth "works" according to mine. They, like our current semi-socialized and heavily controlled system in the U.S. are all rotten failures compared to what is possible under laissez-faire capitalism. America could have been the exception, could have been the only country in the world to have had a robust system of high-quality, low-cost, free market healthcare, but we blew it all because we embraced the idea that freedom is evil and government is the answer to all our problems.
we will all be old wrote:
Are you older than 35 years old? Do you have any medical issues whatsoever - even minor ones? Are you a woman? Have you ever tried getting approved for health insurance?
I doubt the answer to all these questions (even setting aside the woman question) is yes. It's easy to be libertarian when you're young and healthy, or when your big company employer takes care of everything while you doze at your desk for eight hours of zero productivity.
What's wrong with getting health insurance from an employer? I get mine that way. And it's pretty much paid for completely I don't pay a cent. Why wouldn't I do that? Sure, I could afford to buy it myself (make over 100k per year) but why? I love getting benefits. (for doing almost nothing)
You do pay for it. Instead of getting 10k more in salary, you get health insurance. What are the downsides? Well if you can't get into a group, your screwed. If your 60 and you are not getting subsidized by the 20 and 30 year olds, health care gets real expensive in a hurry.Imagine your 50 and you get real sick and can no longer work. You can get Cobra for a couple of years and then your screwed. And if your company goes bankrupt, Cobra goes away. What this does is make it hard for a whole segment of the population to take risks like starting companies. That sucks for everyone. It also means that small companies have to waste time on things like health insurance instead of focusing on providing a better product.And even if you work for a company, you could still be getting screwed. Some HR person is picking the health insurance options you get. They might not be a good match for what you need.
jonathonw wrote:
we will all be old wrote:Are you older than 35 years old? Do you have any medical issues whatsoever - even minor ones? Are you a woman? Have you ever tried getting approved for health insurance?
I doubt the answer to all these questions (even setting aside the woman question) is yes. It's easy to be libertarian when you're young and healthy, or when your big company employer takes care of everything while you doze at your desk for eight hours of zero productivity.
What's wrong with getting health insurance from an employer? I get mine that way. And it's pretty much paid for completely I don't pay a cent. Why wouldn't I do that? Sure, I could afford to buy it myself (make over 100k per year) but why? I love getting benefits. (for doing almost nothing)