What is wrong with Kentucky Track

As a former UK runner that ran in the mid 2000s, I'll second what UK Fan wrote. I don't ever remember doing a workout that took 3 hrs. to complete, and I never remember doing anything like the workout you described. We did do what Weber called "split runs" but they were a couple miles easy, 3 miles tempo, 1 mile easy, ~2 miles tempo. We also often did 200m "cut-downs" at the end of distance runs the day before hard interval work, but not what you described. Like UK Fan said, DW is a believer in high quality, lower mileage. I ran the 800/mile and never remember going over 60 miles/week or running doubles. Our longest runs were around 10 miles out near Keeneland. The true distance guys may have hit 70 or 80 miles/week when I was there, but I can't remember exactly. Also, we did do weights. We had a little circuit that we would do 1-2x/week.

DW has developed some good runners but he hasn't had an outstanding group of guys like Freeman, Doaty, Devenport, in a few years. However, John Richardson seemed to do well while there - multiple SEC titles, and Luis Orta just won the 3k and 5k this weekend at SECs. Not everyone flourishes under his system. Lots of guys simply can't handle the intensity but others have done quite well on it. Thomas Morgan went from being a 4:30 miler in high school to winning SEC XC, running around 3:40 for the 1500 and running in the 13:30s-13:40s for the 5k. Not too shabby.

Weber was an 800 runner in college and I believe that's what he loves to coach. He's won an NCAA XC Championship as a coach, although it was in 1988 with the girls.

He's not a bad coach, but he's no John McDonnell. I just think his training philosophy doesn't work for everyone. He produces some good runners but it's hard to do well in the SEC if you don't have a complete team. LSU, Florida, Arkansas - they're all very good every year and they have/had legendary coaches.

I know I'm rambling now, but you also have to look at the high school running in Kentucky. It's not a hotbed for outstanding HS talent, so that makes the recruiting a bit tougher, too.

He's got 2 top HS 800m runners last year from Canada. One of the guys is 2 seconds over his indoor PR from last year, and the other guy (Neal) just got 6th (1:51.8) in the indoor SEC 800m champs in his first season. Neal has run 1:50.6 this year with an outdoor pr in HS of 1:49.4. We'll see how these 2 develop under his system.

Luis Orta had a fantastic meet. Did he do it on 70mpw?

Does anyone know how Orta is training there?

I think this is correct, however, part of being a great coach is not trying to fit everyone into a "one size fits all" training style. Instead of runners trying to adapt to a system that may not allow them to grow to their fullest potential, you need to figure out what works best for them. Not everyone will grow under a low mileage, high intensity routine. Most days, there were one or maybe 2 variations of a workout for 10-15 guys. All of whom, were all doing different distance events, in different years in college. How freshmen distance runners were doing the same mileage as seniors on the team, is unbelievable to me. Or to put it a different way, I couldn't understand how senior distance runners were doing the same mileage as the freshmen distance runners.

Orta won the 3k and 5k this past weekend and they finished well at the conference xc meet. Nothing is wrong with them

this thread has sparked my interest...would you mind posting a typical Don Weber week for xc and indoor and outdoor track? thanks

Whats going On? wrote:

I see Walter Luttrell second last in the 3000m.

Yes, but he ran a fantastic race for 3rd in the 5k.

UK 1, 3 in the 5k isn't shabby.

This is an actual January week from my log.

Mon: 60 minute fartlek, 11x200 cutdown

Tue: 2x400-600-400-200 at 30/200 w/ 200 jog rec (3min/set)

4 mile run

8x200 cutdown (30-25)

Wed: Swing Run 8 miles

Thu: 3x3x600 1:36, 1:33, 1:31

Fri: Easy 5 miles

Sat: 10 miles crisp. usually finish in 54-56 minutes

Sun: 16 miles

I am not sure where all of this low mileage talk comes from. I ran 60-85 miles a week for most of the season.

agreed. We maintained 70-80 during cross

Well that is a recent phenomenon. Sundays were always off, no running at all. Cross country mileage was probably around 50-60 miles a week tops for pretty much everybody.

anotherformerwildcat wrote:

agreed. We maintained 70-80 during cross

Weber didn't say long run, he just assumed the guys would do it. Even take the long run out, the mileage woul be about 65 to 70 each week.

Apparently you haven't seen SEC distance lately. With the Kenyans at Alabama and Auburn gone and Arkansas distance nowhere near what it used to be, weak is an understatement. While winning the 3k/5k is a great achievement, look who he was racing.

SECrunner wrote:

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Thomas Morgan went from being a 4:30 miler in high school to winning SEC XC, running around 3:40 for the 1500 and running in the 13:30s-13:40s for the 5k. Not too shabby.

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Get the facts accurate before posting. Thomas Morgan ran under 4:20 for the 1600m in high school.

The problem IS Weber.

Thomas Morgan's Ghost wrote:

I don't think Thomas can influence the old guy (Weber) to train like Div 1 schools should. how long does Weber have left there?

whats a swing run?

huh? duh? what wrote:

whats a swing run?

n00b

UKObserver, I guess I should've done a little research on Morgan's HS PRs. I just remember he was good in HS but didn't remember he ran that fast. Now that I looked it up, he ran at least 4:18 and a 1:57 800m. I was just trying to let people know that there have been plenty of guys that have done well under Coach Weber. He, along with many others, have made big improvements while at UK.

Sounds like a great place to go to school if you aren't going to be an Olympic Caliber athelete anyways! I'd have loved only doing 40 to 50 miles a week.