Why can't teachers be like they were in the 50's & early 60's

It was a less diverse group of students, who shared a similar respect for God, family and country.

No Nosense Oldster wrote:

Our education system was damn good. This was the system educated the population that lead the world in innovation, space exploration, and culture. The teachers didn't put up with crap from kids or parents or politicians. Schools weren't so worried about mainstreaming special ed kids, kids dropping, or kids "left behind" If a kid doesn't want to be in school let him drop out rather than be a drain on the system and a distraction to others. There was no voucher bull crap back then.

I don't know if teachers had unions back then but the system WORKED.

You're right but the blame goes to parents, who hire lawyers. I'm a teacher, I deal with it all the time. No kid can do wrong. I once had a father yell at me because his daughter did poorly on a test. He asked me how I could give such a nice girl such a bad grade.

When I was a kid, I was locked in a plywood box in a dark closet for over an hour -- I was a hellraiser.

After that, I became a model student.

This was about 1981. Imagine if that happened now?

I don't disagree with either response, but there are some other complications, as well:

1) We try not to routinely shuffle black kids/poor kids/Latino kids/other non-white kids off to poor-performing schools and then forget about them. We educate them. That changes things.

2) We do the same for special ed students.

3) Our curriculum is much more diverse (which may not be for the better, for sure).

4) Advances in communication mean that parents can say whatever they want to teachers and administrators at any time of day or night--and they do. You would not believe some of the garbage in my inbox, from people who would never speak such nonsense to my face.

5) We no longer have community schools with local control. Most school districts are large and challenging to manage, and they cannot provide the personal attention that you may have had 60 years ago.

There were some things teachers did back then that were wrong, but they had autonomy and authority. Some did abuse it but over all it was better then todays teachers whom are always afraid to act or they get themselves into trouble. If you were a bad kid you never knew what the teacher might do. Now if you are a bad kid the teacher is more worried they they might get in trouble and the OTHERS kids suffer.

Charles Nonhomogenous wrote:

When I was a kid, I was locked in a plywood box in a dark closet for over an hour -- I was a hellraiser.

After that, I became a model student.

This was about 1981. Imagine if that happened now?

runn wrote:

You're right but the blame goes to parents, who hire lawyers. I'm a teacher, I deal with it all the time. No kid can do wrong. I once had a father yell at me because his daughter did poorly on a test. He asked me how I could give such a nice girl such a bad grade.

It is even worse than that. The admins are so afraid of lawsuits that they will cow down to the parents. There was that teacher a few years ago that made national news when she quit teaching permanently, after she flunked 28 kids for cheating on the final. The god damn SCHOOL BOARD overturned it and passed the kids, because the parents were raising a stink about it. The principal and vice principal, as well as a couple of other teachers also quit over it.

Did you know that if a kid has ANY learning or speech disability you can't suspend him without a committe meeting to determine that what he did wasn't a reflection of his disability.

My mother taught in the 60s and was a student in the 50s. The biggest difference was that schools were very small compared to today. A high school was typically a few hundred. Now, many high schools are 2-3000. Same but smaller for elementary and middle. Principals in schools new all the students names.

There was also a surprising amount of equity in what was an inequitable educational system. You did not have huge disparity in the funding and quality of schools from one neighborhood to the next. That did not materialize until white flight from urban areas in the 1970s.

On the other hand, teaching methods in the 50s and 60s were pretty awful compared to today. Lots of rote memorization. Kids had very poor access to information (small libraries, dated enclyclopedias, etc.). Kids with learning disabilities were rarely diagnosed and given assistance. There was also a lot of blatant political indoctrination in schools that led to major conflicts not just at universities, but in high schools during Vietnam.

On the balance, the good public schools today are way better than the 1950s and 60s. But the bad public schools are waaaayyy worse than the 50s and 60s.

I think education in the US is suffering as a result of political correctness, poor parenting, reduced sense of power and effectiveness of the teacher and too much pandering to the lower end kids, while the good ones are made to wait it out and be bored, and a sense of entitlement by kids.

Look at the filtering process when it comes time for college. The top kids get in, do well and get on with life. The rest slide thru with some crappy lib arts degree and struggle thru menial jobs (for the most part) of flunk out.

Well the truth is that if we know this is how life ends up, we need to be honest and start that filtering process early. Focus on who is ready and willing to achieve. Work with these kids and drive them hard to succeed.

If there are other kids who lack this desire to succeed for whatever reason, then work with them separately and see what they can make of themselves.

Why waste everyones time and end up with a hodgepodge of kids where no one really learns much of anything, the teachers are frustrated and the results of any testing are mediocre at best.

I can hear the whining about "tracking" starting already, but as I said earlier, whether you like it or not, the kids who end up in good colleges and good majors have somehow been tracked once they set foot on campus. Its just a fact of life.

Not everyone is cut out for college, lets face that reality and start the process early. Everyone gets a shot, and if some dont take it the first time, they can always change their attitudes and their majors later in life.

Bring rigor back into the classroom. And be fair to everyone involved in the process.

Yeah.

I remember Mrs. Sweet hanging a 1st grader from the coat hook and Mr. Sweeney blasting a kid through the wall.

I recall the boys down South turning dogs and firehoses on black students.

Kids who were different getting the crap kicked out of them.

The good old days

Teachers are different now because society is so different. Both parents working = guilt at not spending time with kids = give kids everything they want and don't discipline them = give teachers crap when kids eff up at school = kids have a ridiculous sense of entitlement.

I love being a teacher EXCEPT for having to deal with parents who don't know how to parent.

I've had parents tell me their son/daughter should not be required to do homework as the student is in sports.

Sports>Education in their minds.

So this education system that worked taught you to put an apostrophe between the zero and the s when writing '50s and '60s? Looks like your wonderful system failed you.

No Nosense Oldster wrote:

Our education system was damn good. This was the system educated the population that lead the world in innovation, space exploration, and culture. The teachers didn't put up with crap from kids or parents or politicians. Schools weren't so worried about mainstreaming special ed kids, kids dropping, or kids "left behind" If a kid doesn't want to be in school let him drop out rather than be a drain on the system and a distraction to others. There was no voucher bull crap back then.

I don't know if teachers had unions back then but the system WORKED.

It worked and the teachers definitely had more authority, but keep in mind they could beat the hell out of you with wood and fiberglass paddles at will. I saw kids get lit up so bad they could barely walk for days.

Because the young teachers weren't even born yet, the middle age teachers were little kids, and the old teachers were young adults. Time marches on, we all get older.

Well it certainly taught me to make a generalization about a whole educational system based on the use of an apostrophe in a messgae board post would be a fairly dumb thing to do.What did your system teach you about over generalizations?

'50s, not 50's wrote:

So this education system that worked taught you to put an apostrophe between the zero and the s when writing '50s and '60s? Looks like your wonderful system failed you.

Nominated for the most ironic post in the history of the internet.You're not an English teacher, are you?...OR ARE YOU? Haha

'50s, not 50's wrote:

So this education system that worked taught you to put an apostrophe between the zero and the s when writing '50s and '60s? Looks like your wonderful system failed you.

For the most part, schools in the '50s and '60s (not 50's and 60's) taught people to be cogs in a a machine. Kids learned to put up with tedium because they were going to go on to be lathe operators and crap like that. The education system filled this role pretty well, but the world has changed and that model no longer makes sense. Baring complete economic collapse, Americans will never again work as lathe operators.

I'd like to see some shred of evidence for your assertion that schools in those days taught people to innovate to a greater extent than they did in other decades. The explosion of computer technology was led by people who were educated after the time period you mention (Wozniak, Jobs, Gates, et al). Can you provide any proof that those educated in the '50s and early '60s brought about more innovation than people educated after? Anyone with a halfway decent education would know to provide evidence for such a claim before being asked.

No Nosense Oldster wrote:

Well it certainly taught me to make a generalization about a whole educational system based on the use of an apostrophe in a messgae board post would be a fairly dumb thing to do.

What did your system teach you about over generalizations?

What the hell are you talking about? I didn't make any generalizations about the whole educational system. I said that the system failed him. How is pointing out that one single person apparently didn't lean basic grammar a generalization, cunt?