Future Star: 1600 in 4:05 at High School Dual Meet

tmcarroll wrote:

Marcus Dickson of White River HS in Buckley, WA runs the 1600 in 4:05 at a dual meet. Wonder what he can do with some competition...

Video here:

http://www.flotrack.org/coverage/248438-2012-Outdoor-Track-and-Field-Season/video/633114-Marcus-Dickson-US-1-1600-405

I agree some comp would be helpful, but it's hardly like it was just a dual meet. This was obviously a setup for him to run fast as he was paced through 800.

Obviously this kid has some talent, but I'd rather see him run in a big invitational with other decent runners, cones or aluminum barriers on the curves, no pacing done by another kid (honestly I think that's a bit lame in a high school dual meet race or maybe even ANY high school race), and no people running on the infield with him the last 100 meters.

Why was it awesome when Bannister did it but bad now? You just described almost to a T the first sub-4 mile.

Flagpole wrote:

Obviously this kid has some talent, but I'd rather see him run in a big invitational with other decent runners, cones or aluminum barriers on the curves, no pacing done by another kid (honestly I think that's a bit lame in a high school dual meet race or maybe even ANY high school race), and no people running on the infield with him the last 100 meters.

Wow, just wow. Are you freaking kidding me Flag?

Azaleas wrote:

Why was it awesome when Bannister did it but bad now? You just described almost to a T the first sub-4 mile.

I'm not for that in high school. So the pacer kid sacrifices his own race to pace the 4:05 kid? I'd never ask a kid on a team to do that, and I wouldn't let them if they asked. Every kid should try to do the best they can in every race. Now, perhaps the pacer kid just was trying to hang on as long as possible and bit off more than he could chew, but I doubt it.

Dennis Reynolds wrote:

Flagpole wrote:

Obviously this kid has some talent, but I'd rather see him run in a big invitational with other decent runners, cones or aluminum barriers on the curves, no pacing done by another kid (honestly I think that's a bit lame in a high school dual meet race or maybe even ANY high school race), and no people running on the infield with him the last 100 meters.

Wow, just wow. Are you freaking kidding me Flag?

Nope. Not kidding. The kid is awesome. The circumstances surrounding the race were not.

Flagpole wrote:

I'm not knocking this kid at all...not one bit. What I'm knocking is the pacing and the lack of restraint from teammates...they shouldn't be running with him on the infield. The kid is great. The pacing, the lack of a barrier on the curves, the teammates...not so great.

Flagpole, you're being a bit extreme. These are highschool kids, some of the teammates are surely 14-15 year olds. This is perfectly acceptable for HS kids. At a big meet sure, there should be more rules and stuff set up, but surely not for a dual meet. They are kids having fun, and it was his chance at a school record and everyone knew he was going for it.

that was amazing.

Well, I don't agree that it's acceptable. Precisely BECAUSE those kids are 14-15 years old, the rules should be enforced at dual meets so that one of them doesn't make a mistake like that when it really counts and gets their teammate DQ'd.Not sure how it works at that kid's school, but at the high school where my daughter attends and my son will attend, we have "pay to play". $150 per sport off the bat and then another $30 to the boosters. We then also have to buy the uniform and pay for one over night meet per sport (CC and track). I'm not paying all that money so my kid can pace some other kid, AND if my kid is ever the one setting the school record, I wouldn't want someone else's kid pacing my kid either. Have some self respect...go out there and try to do YOUR best on that day. There are only so many opportunities to try to run your own PR. I would be disappointed in my kids' coaches if they were asked to pace some other kid or they asked some other kid to pace them. What an awkward thing later when dealing with the other parents. "Yeah, we know your kid sucks, so he's the patsy that paces my kid."

Mrr82 wrote:

Flagpole wrote:

I'm not knocking this kid at all...not one bit. What I'm knocking is the pacing and the lack of restraint from teammates...they shouldn't be running with him on the infield. The kid is great. The pacing, the lack of a barrier on the curves, the teammates...not so great.

Flagpole, you're being a bit extreme. These are highschool kids, some of the teammates are surely 14-15 year olds. This is perfectly acceptable for HS kids. At a big meet sure, there should be more rules and stuff set up, but surely not for a dual meet. They are kids having fun, and it was his chance at a school record and everyone knew he was going for it.

That was flat out. Competition is not going to make him run any faster than he did today, although improvements in fitness will. Great run. I agree with Flagpole that it's corny to have a pacer. Really don't care about his bud running with him the last 80 yards or so. That happened to me in a HS 800m once(completely out of my control) and almost got DQ'ed over it.

How is a 'full mile' different from a mile?

meme myself and I wrote:

Like maybe the Brooks PR indoor where he took down a stellar field in 4:07-low for the full mile, or the Shoreline Invite, where he won easily in 1:49.4?

"Some" talent? God what a nitpicky bunch of A-holes on this board.

Flagpole wrote:

Obviously this kid has some talent, but I'd rather see him run in a big invitational with other decent runners, cones or aluminum barriers on the curves, no pacing done by another kid (honestly I think that's a bit lame in a high school dual meet race or maybe even ANY high school race), and no people running on the infield with him the last 100 meters.

kid needs to work on his form

CAn anyone vouch for this kid's character. Would he use drugs?

Another thing is age. How old is he, perhaps too old for high school.

well he probably wouldn't use drugs cause hes mormon...

What does "pay to play" have to do with anything? What do you have against one teammate helping out another? Would you bitch if your kid was forced to lay down a sac bunt in baseball? I think your argument that the pacer "sacrificed his race" is total BS. It's a dual meet, they happen every week (twice a week?) and no one really cares about the outcome. In T&F everything is decided at postseason meets.

I used to pace teammates to District qualifying times all the time in high school. When I was a freshman, a senior did the same thing for me. If you like your teammates, you're happy to do it.

1) Pay to play is relevant, because I'm not paying all that money to have my kid sacrifice a race to pace someone else.2) Track ain't baseball. Baseball is a team game. Winning the game is the most important thing. When you put down a sacrifice bunt, it doesn't hurt your batting average because it's not counted as an at bat, AND you're likely to get several other at bats in that game. No need to help the 4:05 kid, because he was going to win no matter what...only question was how fast he would go. Lame to sacrifice a race to help him.3) A kid should care about every race they are in. If they don't and the coaches don't, then why have dual meets at all? I could get behind that, but IF there is a dual meet, and IF you are running in it, then you should do the best you can do. Pacing a kid in high school is ludicrous. You say no one cares about the outcome of a dual meet, well then, why try to get a kid to a fast time in one?

Flagpole wrote:

1) Pay to play is relevant,

It's not "pay to play". It is "pay to participate." A pacer is participating as is someone sitting on the bench in team sports.