Breaking 19:00 for the 5K

are you a girl?

if not, why would anyone care how training is going for a 19 min 5k'er? i don't mean to be a jerk. Even if you're a guy, I think it's great you're running and setting goals.

i know i know...if you don't have anything nice to say, keep your trap shut...but i'm keeping it real here. otherwise the boards are no fun at all. might as well be posting at runner's world.com

serious questioner wrote:

are you a girl?

if not, why would anyone care how training is going for a 19 min 5k'er? i don't mean to be a jerk. Even if you're a guy, I think it's great you're running and setting goals.

i know i know...if you don't have anything nice to say, keep your trap shut...but i'm keeping it real here. otherwise the boards are no fun at all. might as well be posting at runner's world.com

Serious Questioner=Serious Jerk. Grow up and allow people to ENJOY the sport for a change.

serious questioner wrote:

are you a girl?

if not, why would anyone care how training is going for a 19 min 5k'er? i don't mean to be a jerk. Even if you're a guy, I think it's great you're running and setting goals.

i know i know...if you don't have anything nice to say, keep your trap shut...but i'm keeping it real here. otherwise the boards are no fun at all. might as well be posting at runner's world.com

Thanks for sharing that insight. This board is so much more "real" with people like you posting. Obviously your opinion about someone else's times are WAY more important than that someone's goals and aspirations. People should just not talk if they aren't elite runners, ya know? The boards should ask what your PR's are when you register and if they aren't good enough you're blocked from posting. Who cares if you PR'd by 2 minutes in a 5k? You going to the Olympics? Then stop wasting my time. How can people even live with themselves if they are that slow?

Seriously though, to the person who started this thread (man or woman, it doesn't matter): good job in starting a public log. It definitely helps keep you honest. I have always used other peoples' nay-saying as motivation. "You don't think I can do it? What the hell do you know about my body?" Keep up the good work and keep training!

Okay, back to the other guy: Can you explain the logic behind how making fun of people sharing their PRs and training routines is "keeping it real"?

The OP is a woman. As a guy, there's no way you can have a PR of 18:30 and run in college. I had a PR of 15:52 and I had to beg and grovel just to be allowed to walk on for a season.

PRs do not lie wrote:

The OP is a woman. As a guy, there's no way you can have a PR of 18:30 and run in college. I had a PR of 15:52 and I had to beg and grovel just to be allowed to walk on for a season.

That's what I thought, but the thing is that 29:25 for 5 miles is a faster pace than the pace for an 18:30 5K. If it's a she, she must have done a lot more 5Ks in college than 5 milers. So it makes no sense to me.

Therefore, I conclude that it's a troll. Trollie, trollie, trollie, trollie!!

To everyone... LOL!

I'm a guy. And yeah that 5k time is crap because I never raced a 5k in college. I never raced an 8k either, because I wasn't actually on the team they put in races, I was a hanger-on, I worked out with the team and only raced in the podunk nonstandard races that didn't count. So the 5k time is from a guess based on an 18:00 3 mile split during an 8 mile team workout. So yeah it sucks.

I just remembered another PR:

2 mile - 10:15

But really the PRs from back then don't mean much now, I'm just working on getting back into shape at all.

PRs do not lie wrote:

As a guy, there's no way you can have a PR of 18:30 and run in college.

that's not true at all. plenty of schools have guys that run around that time. i would guess that most of them are walk-ons. i can tell you that i run for a college xc team and only had a 18:xx pr in high school. and yeah, i know that that is "slow".

Seriously, what do you gain if you run a 19min 5k.

Looking at that mileage from no running at all I would say you are making a mistake that will result in injury.

I would suggest you cut all of the mileage numbers in half and run the race for fun without a watch on.

You will have much more fun and your girlfriend could care less how fast you run. She just does not want to see you pouting around the house because you are hurt and can't go to the race.

4:24 1500m is probably equivalent to 16:15-25 on the tables.

jonesy. wrote:

4:24 1500m is probably equivalent to 16:15-25 on the tables.

Yeah it is. I ran that time at the last meet of indoor season the year I ran... I had a lot of miles under my belt from the winter when I had done no racing. I was probably averaging 50 MPW or so for 3 months before that, 30-40MPW for the three months before those. That time puts me at a VDOT of 63 which would be suicide for me to train at right now.

not an insult wrote:

Seriously, what do you gain if you run a 19min 5k.

Looking at that mileage from no running at all I would say you are making a mistake that will result in injury.

I would have to disagree. I've bumped right up to 30 MPW in the past and had no problems whatsoever. And that was with a lot more strenuous quality work than what I am planning for this run-up. I'm going to work off a VDOT of 44, which is going to put a lot of stuff at a speed that is pretty slow for me, allowing plenty of recovery. (for those not familiar, VDOT is the Daniels measure of performance by which you plan your running paces)

Basically the whole goal of this 10 week plan is to get a more valid VDOT at the end via the 5k race, so that I can better calibrate my training in the future. 19:00 is just a time I plucked out of my ass, and I truly believe I can run much better than that in 10 weeks. 19:00 really represents the minimum I want to do, if I stay healthy.

19:59 is 50% Vdot

6:26 per mile pace.

Where are you in elevation?

2500 feet or above 4000?

What's your Plan B if you're not sub 19 in your goal race in June?

I'm between 4000 and 5000 feet. I've been here for about a year though. The race will be in this town, at the same elevation. Last year I ran it and got in the high 20:00's off of pretty close to zero training (had run about 10 times over 3 weeks beforehand).

Plan B? Not sure. I guess just adjust my goals for the rest of the year accordingly.

And the VDOT I'm going for is 53 (18:58 5k). I think it's a makeable goal, given that I don't get hurt or majorly sick between now and June.

IdahoRunner wrote:

I just remembered another PR:

2 mile - 10:15

You can run 10:15 for 2 miles and are having problems breaking 19:00 for 5k?

This is my suggestion. Run a 10:15 two miler, then jog very slowly for 1.1 miles.

WEEK 1 UPDATE:

Date Dist Time Pace Comments

4/13 - none

4/14 - 2.7 mi 25:13 9:20

4/15 - Swim - 10 laps

4/16 - 3.5 mi 31:05 8:53

4/17 - 3.5 mi 30:50 8:48

4/18 - 3.5 mi 30:09 8:36 Right Achilles Tight

4/19 - 4.3 mi 38:00 8:50 Achilles somewhat better, been stretching

Swim - 11 laps

Week - 17.5 mi

-------------

I'm on target for mileage, and feeling about as expected. All the runs were within the range I was going for (8:45-9:30) with the exception of one, because it was dark and I don't think I had a good perception of my speed that day. My easy pace on the Daniels chart is actually 9:27 but I'm erring to the faster side to keep my form, it starts to break down at about that pace.

My right achilles started getting tight Friday, so I am hitting it extra on the stretching. Also hitting my hip flexors and quads a lot because I have a sedentary job where I sit all day, and they get tight.

Overall, things are going to plan so far.

Peace

IdahoRunner, it's good your going at your training intelligently. The reason everyone seems to think your a girl, or a troll, ect. is because your PR's indicate your much faster than 19mins!! If thats truly all you can do then more power to you, but if I were you I would aim for sub 17. Best of luck in either case!

Blaze wrote:

IdahoRunner, it's good your going at your training intelligently. The reason everyone seems to think your a girl, or a troll, ect. is because your PR's indicate your much faster than 19mins!! If thats truly all you can do then more power to you, but if I were you I would aim for sub 17. Best of luck in either case!

Heh, yeah I understand that. I guess the point I'm trying to get across is that I haven't really trained for a couple years, and those PRs don't really apply right now to my training. They do apply, however, to my potential, which is a different beast.

The way that I'm looking at this 10 week training block, is that this entire time is an injury prevention time. I want to get back to where my legs don't feel like shit after running 3 miles. I mean, look at the week 1 mileage... that wasn't easy on my legs. My cardiovascular system is screaming FASTER, but my body can't take it and I know that.

And for what it's worth, I do forsee a faster time than 19:00. I only picked that because it corresponds on the Daniels tables to a marathon time of about 3:00:00, which is my secondary goal (a 45 minute PR, by the way). So 19:00 is like the bare minimum I want to run.

Just wait and see, I really think this approach is going to work for me.

The fact of the matter is, I could have named this "Breaking 18:00" or "Breaking 17:00" or "Breaking 16:00" or "Breaking 15:00" and there would have been lots of assholes coming in to make snide comments. I'm here to make long term progress, while minimizing the risk of injury. I'm putting it up on the site, because I know there are mediocre runners like me out there who can use the info, and it acts as a way to force me to collect my thoughts on my training.

Peace!

Hey Idadho runner: as it happens, I've a similar story to yours. 4hr marathon before, 1 32 half marathons, 31:30 5miles, 18:30ish 5k.

don't mind the assholes, no need to engage with them, its not gonna go anywhere. You should keep up your training and do 1k repeats at below your intended race pace as well as gym strengthening work. 90secs recovery say. keep up your mileage and stretching and do a 5,000m on the track on a good day and GIVE IT SOCKS, you'll get 16mins+

watcha think?

ditch the 30min/day - try 45-50min every other day. Throw in a 30s-1min walk break every 10min or so until you can be on your feet for an hour w/o any complaints from your legs. Ignore the distance you cover, run for time. After a month of 45min - 1 hr at least 3x / week, add a long run, build to 90min. do some strides. this is joe henderson / hal higdon territory - check out hal's website - after you outgrow those schedules (1 or 2 years) move on to daniels of pfitz.

Ummmmmm wrote:

You can run 10:15 for 2 miles and are having problems breaking 19:00 for 5k?

This is my suggestion. Run a 10:15 two miler, then jog very slowly for 1.1 miles.

Most of the posts in this thread are just assholes trying to be funny... except this one. Seriously, you shouldn't have this much trouble breaking 19. Try doing whatever you were doing in training when you ran 10:15.

I think you're doing a good job right now, just steadily increase mileage without getting hurt. It's obvious that you can run way faster than you have (18:30?) so just put it together and it'll come easy.