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LetsRun.com
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So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/19/2012 11:28PM Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
We just got an email from an irate LRC visitor.

The collegiate coaches association has been playing up their Bowerman award - which they invented in 2009 to be track's version of the Heisman. It hasn't quite caught on with the mainstream media (or even us just yet - as we almost forgot it was given out tonight), but it's a good idea.

But he was really mad about the women's selection for 2012.

Guess who didn't win?

Arizona high jumper Brigetta Barrett

All she's done is over the last two years is win 24 of 25 collegiate competitions and 4 NCAA titles.

This year, and the award is solely for 2012, she was undefeated indoors and out at the collegiate level- 13 and 0. Went to the Olympics and won silver.

The only way to do better than that would be to win Olympic gold we guess.

The winner was LSU's Kimberly Duncan.The visitor was irate as she wasn't an Olympian. As he wrote, "Olympic Medalist vs non Olympian."

But Duncan did score way more points as she won the 200 indoors and out. Was 2nd in the 100, 8th in the 60 and = was on the winning 4 x 100 ad on the runner-up 4 x 400.

The coaches made the right decision based on the awards stipulations which state.


"The Bowerman is awarded each year to the top male collegiate athlete and to the top female collegiate athlete in the sport of NCAA track & field.

Athletes’ performances during the NCAA indoor track & field and outdoor track & field seasons shall be considered. An athlete need not have competed in both seasons to be eligible for the award.

Only performances from the NCAA indoor track & field and outdoor track & field seasons of the year in which the award is given should be considered. For example, performances from the 2009 outdoor track & field season should not be considered for the 2010 award.


What do you think? Should non-collegiate action be considered?
there are other awards
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/19/2012 11:36PM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

LetsRun.com wrote:

Should non-collegiate action be considered?


No
Absolutely not.
Never
Pointless
Old Runner
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/19/2012 11:38PM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Sure it should be considered... But only as a deciding factor when for all practical purposes the decision process comes to a tie. Other than that, maybe it shouldn't count since it isn't reflective of the stated goals of determining the award.
coach d
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/19/2012 11:47PM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
So, what you're saying is that NCAA coaches should consider in awarding the award for NCAA-only competition: Performances in the same Olympic games that an NCAA coach was prohibited by NCAA rules to coach in?

Totally ridiculous.
anotherposter
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 12:08AM - in reply to coach d Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
what about a 7-time NCAA champ and NCAA record holder....
coach d
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 12:37AM - in reply to anotherposter Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
The Bowerman is for NCAA competition and that's it. As I understand it, nothing else is allowed to be considered. If you don't like those rules, you can submit a change for a vote, as was done with the bring back the mile thing.
lack of diversity
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 12:40AM - in reply to coach d Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
white girl was robbed.
QTPi
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 1:18AM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
to those saying duncan was the right choice:
what would a high jumper have to do to win the award?
i don't think it's right to give such a strong preference to athletes who compete in a variety of similar events...
26mi235
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 2:50AM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
The award was determined n June -- they present it at their major confab in the year -- kind of silly to wait 6 months when they could have presented it at the time of the USATF.
jsquire
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 4:30AM - in reply to 26mi235 Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
The deadline for submitting ballots was BEFORE the Olympics began, so don't start with the Olympic medal stuff. Also, voters are clearly directed to consider the collegiate season only and to disregard everything that happens after the NCAA outdoor championships.

I'm a voter and given those criteria, I chose Duncan.
ccrunner609
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 9:09AM - in reply to jsquire Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Of course she scored more points, she had 4 events in most meets......the HJ girl only had one.
rojo
co-founder
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 10:27AM - in reply to QTPi Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

QTPi wrote:

to those saying duncan was the right choice:
what would a high jumper have to do to win the award?
i don't think it's right to give such a strong preference to athletes who compete in a variety of similar events...


That's what I was thinking at first but then I thought this is supposed to like the Heisman - and they have that same type of biases/intrigue.

A defensive player has never won the Heisman. I don't think a lineman has either.

It's hard for a lot of track fans to admit but all events aren't created equally. The 100/200 sprint - those are the QBs of our sport.

Acknowledging the differences in the events is one of the reason Letsrun is actually successful. So many track purists basically treat all events equally.

I thik the bigger question is, "Should post-collegiate competition be considered?"

That's a real tough one. I see why they don't do it as this is a collegiate award. But since track is known on most college campuses as one of the "Olympic sports" it's also easy to justify.

On a lot of campuses, this sport is funded to get theem Sears points or whatever it's called now and then generate some good publicity either with some conference/NCAA wins,sub 4 miles or Olympic births.
Barakus Obama
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 10:35AM - in reply to coach d Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

coach d wrote:

So, what you're saying is that NCAA coaches should consider in awarding the award for NCAA-only competition: Performances in the same Olympic games that an NCAA coach was prohibited by NCAA rules to coach in?

Totally ridiculous.


What?! That sounds idiotic.
Look at the Numbers
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 10:35AM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
Look at the numbers.
How many girls go out for the 100, 200, and 400 in the NCAAs.
How many girls did Duncan have to beat to get to the top?
How many girls in the NCAA go out for the HJ?
How many could be considered National or World class?
I'd vote for Duncan.
elitist (but not elite)
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 10:38AM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
What part of "NCAA Track Athlete of the Year" do you not understand?
The Animal Within
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 10:57AM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
No doubt the silver medal is a superior performance. As a 100 meter sprinter you clearly have more events to choose and... it's a silver medal!

That said, the athlete that won the 200 meters and scored more points in the NCAA Championship should be the track athlete of the year.

Tim Tebow won the Heisman, but he did not go #1 in the NFL draft. So one might argue the "Athlete of the Year" was not the best player. It is just the way it goes.
johnny waterski
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 11:10AM - in reply to rojo Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

rojo wrote:

[quote]QTPi wrote:

to those saying duncan was the right choice:
what would a high jumper have to do to win the award?
i don't think it's right to give such a strong preference to athletes who compete in a variety of similar events...


That's what I was thinking at first but then I thought this is supposed to like the Heisman - and they have that same type of biases/intrigue.

A defensive player has never won the Heisman. I don't think a lineman has either.

It's hard for a lot of track fans to admit but all events aren't created equally. The 100/200 sprint - those are the QBs of our sport.

Acknowledging the differences in the events is one of the reason Letsrun is actually successful. So many track purists basically treat all events equally.
*****************************************************

Charles Woodson won the Heisman in 1997
Check your facts
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 11:16AM - in reply to rojo Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
A defensive player has never won the Heisman.

Charles Woodson won it as a cornerback in 1997. He also returned punts but was primarily a defensive player.
uh huh
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 11:20AM - in reply to LetsRun.com Reply | Return to Index | Report Post
i'm willing to bet Brigetta Barrett really doesn't care too much. she just won a f%cking silver medal! i'm sure that will be remembered more than the bowerman award....

i'd take an olympic medal over any other athletics award. period
Shoebacca
RE: So an undefeated collegiate woman who won an Olympic silver medal isn't the NCAA track AOY - a non Olympian is? 12/20/2012 11:37AM - in reply to QTPi Reply | Return to Index | Report Post

QTPi wrote:

to those saying duncan was the right choice:
what would a high jumper have to do to win the award?
i don't think it's right to give such a strong preference to athletes who compete in a variety of similar events...


This is the most insightful quote. She won 100% of her competitions that senior year and then got the silver. Would they have considered her any more strongly if she had won the gold? Or would she have had to place in a sprint event to get consideration? I can understand rewarding multi-event athletes, but it's a big snub to a field athlete at the top of her game.
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