| hgwells |
| ||
|
I'm an assistant coach for a XC and Track and Field team this year and one kid in particular has piqued my attention. He started the XC season as number 2 varsity (quite slower than number 1, but he was only a first year guy). This was before any races, on 5 mile runs he would come back right after our fast guy, and likewise, in repeats he would finish with the rest of the fast guys (He said he ran 600 miles over the summer and got a strong aerobic base). Less than a week into our training, though, he started getting beaten by some guys who he had beaten the day before. By our first race he was the #10 on the team, and by the last he was #17. At first, I was sure he overtrained, as he still went hard on the "easy" days, but after putting in 600 miles between XC and track he was still slower than the guys who he had been capable of beating months before. This kid is the nicest guy in the world, a great team player, and he tries just as hard as the rest of varsity. I've been watching him for some time now and seriously can't figure out what his problem is. He talked to me last week about this and I hate not being able to give him a straight answer. Coaches, have you ever had runners fade like crazy like this? Why did it happen? Thanks. |
| Westside |
| ||
|
iron |
| hgwells |
| ||
|
OK, I have definitely considered this, but have not had much experience with iron anemia, though one of my teammates in college had anemia and slowed down quite a bit. The kid has commented that he seems to be aerobically stressed earlier in his long runs. What are some symptoms of iron anemia and what should I tell him to do about it? |
| Guppy |
| ||
|
Almost certainly not anemia. That comes on slowly and is pretty uncommon in guys. If it happened a week into YOUR training, the answer should be obvious: it's something with YOUR training. I'm not saying your training is bad, but maybe the kid pushed it too hard in workouts or just do well off of whatever you guys do. Get him back doing what he was doing before he joined the program (after some recovery time). He should be fine. |
| hgwells |
| ||
|
How long does anemia typically take to develop? His slowdown was very much gradual, I'm not sure the scale you're talking about here. Everyday he got a bit slower, not by much, but by the end of season the gradual slowdown got to be pretty significant. Still pretty confused here, but I am leaning towards some form of anemia, or perhaps just a slight lack of iron, any more advice would be awesome. |
| Westside |
| ||
|
In my years of experience at the college level, men can become anemic very often. Harder aerobic runs, threshold workouts, and races is where anemia usually shows itself the most. Athletes struggle feeling sluggish, have dead legs, and feel "burned out." Ferritin levels are one of the first things I have checked with an athlete's performance dwindles both rapidly and gradually over time. He is probably feeling the effects of overtraining and anemia. |
| kang6789 |
| ||
|
anemia |
| Junk Master |
| ||
|
What is his physical build like? I'd guess he's shorter and would respond better to more quality work, speed work. Keep us posted, intriguing. |
| idiot person |
| ||
Dumbest post of the day? |
| hgwells |
| ||
|
Thanks for all the feedback. If I were to guess, I'd say he's about 5'9? Estimating of course, he's a little shorter than average but has grown quite a lot throughout the years, which leads me to wonder whether his development has anything to do with it. His first year doing track our main coach dude said he ran 6:00 and was shocked when he saw him blasting it at workouts. Made it all the more painful for him and me to watch him fade like that. |
| Nah nah |
| ||
|
Sounds like overtraining. How fast are his practice runs? During season, they should be 7:30-8:30 per mile. |
| hgwells |
| ||
|
Update: I told him to get tested yesterday at practice and he just sent me some results. His hemoglobin and hematocrit tests are borderline to anemia, besides that though, I wasn't too sure on what his results meant. He has a hematocrit level of 39 something or other (Average range is 36-50), can't remember his hemoglobin but I will call him up and ask. |
| Seen it all before |
| ||
|
I'd take some down time. Soma kids are head cases. Or maybe you have a workout hero? Plus others were getting into shape while he was already there. Some kids work hard in the offseason and peak for the first meet of the year. Then pretty much stay the same. You can't compare kids, how are his times? Slower? Same? Faster but just not as much improvement? Best of luck with this one. |
| ttgbfdvhun |
| ||
|
Sounds like iron anemia. The above posters are wrong, it is not that rare in men. Here is a primer on the issue http://runningwritings.blogspot.com/2011/11/ferritin-hemoglobin-and-iron-deficiency.html You need to get this kid's hemoglobin a and ferritin checked pronto. |
| dumb |
| ||
Not anemic for a trained endurance athlete judging by those numbers. OP if I am hearing the story correctly he basically had one really good week of practice and then fizzled out? Sounds like a practice hero. |
| Nah nah |
| ||
Not anemic for a trained endurance athlete judging by those numbers. OP if I am hearing the story correctly he basically had one really good week of practice and then fizzled out? Sounds like a practice hero.[/quote] Yeah, if he wants to run his workouts hard, then he needs to run his regular days very slowly like 7:30-8:30 per mile |
| SlowFatMaster |
| ||
|
If the bloodwork turns out normal, maybe he is a Kenny Moore type of guy. By that, I mean someone who needs more easy days than most and needs to take the easy days EASY. Here is an excerpt from Kenny's book about Bowerman that shows the power of hard-easy-easy: http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=kenny%20moore%20bowerman%20dale%20story&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CDAQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.kennymoore.us%2Fkcmarticles%2FThe%2520Man.pdf&ei=oPWJT_3uA-TH0QH6mIzXBg&usg=AFQjCNG1qiRAvlCd9TQRdacM5Zrdon6tVA |
| hgwells |
| ||
|
Nice read, but I'm not sure I want to start him on a workout plan that seems so counter intuitive. How about putting him on this for a period of 3 weeks and seeing where it takes him? Thoughts? |
| juhgyfdeswaxgg |
| ||
|
I still say check his ferritin before making any big decisions. If it is below 25, you found your problem |
| here we go |
| ||
|
People don't "get beat in training." There are kids who run easy runs incredibly slow on my team and destroy everybody at meets, and there are also kids who run 6:30 per mile on easy runs and struggle to break 18:00 for 5000m. You can't judge ability based on easy run and workout because he could be trying harder than the other runners. If you want to really measure your kids' ability, run a time trial instead of guessing based on who comes back first on an easy run. |