I must say I'm totally shocked. 59:43 for the half marathon by an American in January. Running all alone. I don't think you all realize how good a performance that is. Forget the fact it was in January or solo or on a certified course for that matter. LetsRun.com JK says it ranks out timewise as the "second best American performance EVER at any distance."
JK said it ranks slightly ahead of Bob Kennedy's American Record at 5k (12:58.21) coming out to a 12:56.25 on his personal conversion charts. This would rank it only behind Khalid Khannouchi's 2:05:38 in the marathon. (Hall's time comes out to 2:06:51 for the marathon but taking it out to the marathon is of cousre guess work)
Originally I titled the thread "Ryan Hall's Performance The Best American Performance Since...." but now I'm removing the since. So let' discuss where this ranks alltime in terms of American performances. As of now it is a one off performance, so I'm putting Kennedy's 12:58 ahead of him because Kennedy was better relative on the world stage at 5k than Hall is at the half. But I just wanted to start this thread because in the live race results thread we have people posting stuff like this: "Ryan Hall ran an amazing race today, but I remember him starting off his season really strong last year on the roads and the XC course and then under performing on the track last year."
Ryan Hall could not run another step this year and it would be a great year. That's how good this run is and I don't think a lot of your realize it. Its the 9th best time ever on a non aided course (using a 50% separation from start to finish:
58:55 a ( 1) Haile Gebreselasie (ETH) 18 Apr 1973 15 Jan 2006 Tempe AZ USA
59:07 ( 1) Paul Kosgei (KEN) 22 Apr 1978 02 Apr 2006 Berlin GER
59:15.4 ( 1) Zerisenay Tadesse- 2 08 Feb 1982 10 Sep 2006 Rotterdam NED
59:15.8 ( 1) Samuel Wanjiru (KEN) 10 Nov 1986 11 Sep 2005 Rotterdam NED
59:17 ( 1) Paul Tergat- 2 17 Jun 1969 04 Apr 1998 Milan ITA
59:22 ( 1) Paul Tergat- 3 17 Jun 1969 17 Apr 1999 Milan ITA
59:27.1 ( 2) Robert Kipchumba (KEN) 24 Feb 1984 10 Sep 2006 Rotterdam NED
59:29 ( 2) Evans Cheruiyot (KEN) 1980 02 Apr 2006 Berlin GER
Now granted the half marathon is just now becoming a more popular distnace and there are some fast non-certified courses (Lisbon) but regardless Hall'f performance charts out very well. So i'm just opening it up for discussion.
Here's a list that included aided runs:
I think the ARRS site is the most comprehensive in terms of rejecting aided performances:
and they explain why they exclude lisbon certain years:
But maybe it is good to see one with all the aided performances on there like you have provided.
But I want to try and keep this thread on the topic of where Hall's performance ranks.
I was actually having this same discussion earlier today when I found out about the result, and I also ranked it as the 2nd best US performance of all time.
KK's WR marathon at London
Hall's sub-60 1/2 marathon
Kennedy's sub-13 5K
Virgin's World Cross wins
Mills' 10K Gold Medal
|Jonny B Good|
MJ's 200 and 400 WR's are both far superior performances, Just like Mo Greene's 9.79 is and Every one of Carl Lewis's performances at 84 olympics. Hall would have got beaten by any number of African's, Your sprinters are far superior to your distance runners, look at your 200 and 400 guys for the true talent in your pathetic country.
I do hope in all of your enthusiasm you keep in mind this is a "road" race and not a track race. I am not trying to take away from this performance, as running such a time in January is great, but let's not project too far as to it's value as a legitimate time on the track for 5k or 10k.
I would rank it as the most surprising.
I'm excluding Mills because I don't remember it.
On Topic: I'd say KK's marathon is obviously the best. I'll give BK and Hall's performances a tie.
According to the IAAF Scoring Tables,
Ryan Hall's 59:43 = 1266 pts.
Michael Johnson's 19.32 = 1335 pts.
Michael Johnson's 43.18 = 1300 pts.
Maurice Greene's 9.79 = 1293 pts.
A 59:43 Half Marathon is "equal" in pts. to the following performances:
3000 Steeple - 7:59.27
I'm a bit skeptical of the middle distance times... However, according to IAAF, Ryan Hall's was the best USA long distance performance ever.
um, who cares?
You're not the only one. I know that he showed a lot of promise in high school and college, and he had several strong xc performances last year, and but what has he done that would suggest this great leap forward?
Any idea how long the course remeasurement and ratification process will take?
Billy Mills gets the top ever distance performance. Hall's run was like Mills very suprising though not an upset. We must remember than performances are not as special if they don't occur at the Olympics. However, Hall's run is amazing in the way that it shows other Americans that they too have the ability to run with other top runners and can shy away from the pathetic excuse that they aren't African, etc. Congrats Ryan for a huge breakthrough!
Sorry, but I don't equate "best" with "most dramatic" or "most attention-grabbing."
For what it's worth, if the course was accurately measured, Hall's performance today was probably the best distance run (from, say, 3000 meters up) of all time by anyone born outside of Africa. It's really astonishing.
Well, he did set the AR for 20k at Drebecen last fall, so it's not totally out of left field.
As for the course measurement, it may have been pre-validated; if so, the records count as soon as they're approved by the USATF records committee. I'll check w/ the validations chair from RRTC to see what the status is for Houston.
Wejo, where the heck does JK get his charts, did he make these conversions himself or what? I am always skeptical about rating performances based on anecdotal evidence.
Man Wejo, I am shocked too. I'm not sure anyone saw that coming.
Ryan Hall has shown by this performance that he is clearly in the same league with Dathan Ritzenhein in all distances, and quite frankly any other American. This was such a superior performance that maybe even in CC he has a real shot at beating a healthy Ritzenhein.
He's been a peg down in my mind due to very inconsistent performances, but regardless of whether he takes a step or two back, this performance is so good that he gets to remain in any discussion about who the best in the US is.
Never thought I'd say that of Webb, Tegenkamp, Hall and Ritzenhein that Ritzenhein is in fourth of that group. Right now he is.
CONGRATULATIONS Ryan Hall. Ryan's AMAZING performance 59:43 (1/2 marathon) have me eagerly awaiting his 10000m debut! I really hope Ryan planned his track 10000m debut overseas against the world top 10000m men and here against a U.S field.